Race":rkj0hve2 said:
Hi Jenn,
I guess then that you have no danger of me stealing your hardworking customers, at any price. Why all the concern on dropshipping if your customers will not go for it. Is it because they work too hard for their money and therefore they will not enjoy Christmas from the Aquatic Santa ? Even I do not have that much pride.
Off to work, talk to you guys in a few days. Thanks, Race.
I really don't think I had too many concerns about it.
The original concern in this thread about dropshipping was SDC's role in doing so for TFO. I simply drew a comparison when I contacted TFO asking about their practices, and you jumped in from there.
I am concerned that their answer wasn't the "whole truth". Given what's been said in their reply, if I knew nothing more about them, I'd go away with the assumption that they house all their own stuff themselves, which would be very misleading.
Given what I do know from Eric's statements in this thread, drop shipping does occur. So I can now assume a couple of things - they may house some stuff and drop ship some stuff, OR they may occupy the same space as SDC and have some sort of "sharing" agreement and therefore their answer was truthful.
My bad I guess for not being completely specific. So to follow up with them I sent the following email this morning:
Thank you for the reply.
Perhaps you can clarify something for me then. I participate in an online message forum for the marine aquarium industry, and your drop shipper admitted he does this for you, in a public forum. He denied it at first, but when a client of his mentioned receiving one of your acclimation sheets in his retail store order from the wholesaler, the truth came out. He has stated for all to see that he does indeed drop ship for you.
So you are telling me you house your own specimens. Is that ALL specimens you sell, or do you house *some* and drop-ship others? You never addressed the drop ship question in my initial email. I made the comparison to Liveaquaria because they house *some* but drop-ship *most*.
Looking forward to your answer.
Jennifer
Somehow I'm not expecting a reply to that one - but we'll see.
My PM box has been buzzing on this topic too - and I even got a phone call about it but alas, I did not have time to speak with the caller because I had a bus load of special ed students learning about marine life in my shop when the party called. Hopefully they call back because I'd like to discuss it more
As for Race and his martyr thing - I'm sure this subject came about last year when he was asked to refrain from posting - but since the subject keeps coming up, I'm sitting here wondering how Race can maintain his position that he's the political voice and savior of the hobby? Savior from what? And who's he saving?
Let's see - let's sell livestock at a loss (which I really have to question the validity of that statement, but I'll take it at face value for the sake of this discussion) - sell it at a loss, guarantee its survival for 14 days regardless of what the buyer does with it, and be the champion to the great unwashed masses of people in this hobby.
Let's think about how that's a "benefit" for the reefs, and the hobbyists for a moment, shall we?
If a hobbyist buys something locally, *maybe* pays more for it (but then again, I didn't see much that was cheaper than I sell it for...), after discussions with a good LFS (and we know there are good and bad everywhere), they've done their homework etc., and it dies after the short LFS guarantee expires, they are more likely to either not try that specie again, OR figure out what they may have done wrong first, before they try another.
With the blanket guarantee - no problem, get a free replacement (with more losses to Race on shipping - right because he loses money every day on shipping...) and carry on. Perhaps a second specimen dies - don't know if Race will replace the second DAA - but even if he doesn't, that's 2 dead for the price of one. That's great for the reefs - NOT.
Meanwhile, as it's perceived by some, this practice "causes" the demise of the local stores that supported the wholesalers for all these years (I don't necessarily agree with that thinking - but it's something that I hear quite a bit that etail will make the LFS extinct). (Allegedly) Selling livestock at a loss also devalues the creatures themselves, so people can buy all they want, regardless of whether it's appropriate for them to or not, because it's cheap. How's that good for the reefs and the hobby?
And as Mitch pointed out, if Petco (or anybody else) is following the same business model, why does Race expect them to funnel him business? It could easily work the other way too. Further devaluing of marine life. That's just great, isn't it?
Feedback that I get from drop-shipped livestock is that for coral frags and little stuff like that, it's fine. For fish, or more delicate creatures, it's often a case of once bitten, twice shy. Plenty of my customers have *tried* ordering online, and once they realize they didn't save anything, or got something they were disappointed with and then stuck with, they opted not to do that again.
I can see it being good for people in areas that aren't served by a local store - but then again it's hard to get into a hobby when you can't find a store to serve you in the first place - usually that's an established hobbyist who relocates to a new area, although not always I guess.
Folks, we don't have to cross the lines of decorum to get our points across - we just have to tell it like it is.
Race, you haven't changed a bit since last year
You have no "low self-esteem" problem that's for sure. I read a good chunk of this thread to my service technician and she left here laughing her head off, well at least she'll serve her customers with a bigger smile today
Jenn
