Speeding ticket question

[Hitsnorth]

I never said anything about insurance or committing fraud. I was talking about turning in your license while your license is clean so that the points get lost in transit. This has nothing to do with insurance or getting over on insurance.

I cant imagine its the worst advice you have ever heard since it worked for me and I certainly didnt commit fraud. At the time I did it I was a legal resident of both pennsylvania and virginia. The points never caught up with me.

And the cop is going to show up for a speeding ticket on a day he is otherwise assigned to do other things? Seems pretty ineffecient to me. I definately have done this in the past and the cop never showed up so I dont see the harm in trying to ask for a continuance once.

Sorry, not looking to start a war but thats got to be the wort advice I've heard. PA and insurance companies doing business in PA take fraud seriously, very seriously :smash:

they tried to subpoena me, my memo book entries for a red lite summons I wrote 12 years ago to a driver with a Pa license. the NYPD informed them that I was retired, scary they found me and offered to pay for my testimony involving fraud. I declined.
1 of 2 options

1 pay the summons take a defensive driving course to rid the points
2 roll the dice plead not guilty

if you post pone the summons trust me the cop will show up

 

[Deanos]

I never said anything about insurance or committing fraud. I was talking about turning in your license while your license is clean so that the points get lost in transit. This has nothing to do with insurance or getting over on insurance.

Purposely switching licenses to prevent getting points has nothing to do with insurance?! What about premiums? :scratch: Please explain your statement.

since it worked for me and I certainly didnt commit fraud. At the time I did it I was a legal resident of both pennsylvania and virginia. The points never caught up with me.

Don't confuse the fact that you "got away with it", with not committing fraud. Intentionally exploiting loopholes in interstate vehicular compacts is still considered fraud.

Dean

 

[Hitsnorth]

Im not even sure all states recognize points from another state.

He was talking about getting insurance in Pennsylvania rather then in NJ. I wasnt talking about insurance or getting insurance in another state, I was talking about points on a license. If you have no car insurance this isnt even a factor(I dont have car insurance because I have no car right now so again your assumptions that I was directing him to commit insurance fraud are incorrect)

Since your the link guru please show me some case law that supports your claim that its fraud to turn your license in another state and the points never made it. You think someone should be held liable for flaws in a system? People take advantage of grey areas all the time.

Let me be clear. I am in NO WAY advocating fraud. I was giving advice and you should consult an attorney if you have doubts about it being legal. The fact is when I did it I did consult an attorney and was advised I was NOT doing anything illegal by taking advantage of the system. Please dont accuse me of commiting fraud. The fact is incorrectly accusing someone of fraud is libelous.

 

[NYPDFrogman]

I never said anything about insurance or committing fraud. I was talking about turning in your license while your license is clean so that the points get lost in transit. This has nothing to do with insurance or getting over on insurance.

I cant imagine its the worst advice you have ever heard since it worked for me and I certainly didnt commit fraud. At the time I did it I was a legal resident of both pennsylvania and virginia. The points never caught up with me.

And the cop is going to show up for a speeding ticket on a day he is otherwise assigned to do other things? Seems pretty ineffecient to me. I definately have done this in the past and the cop never showed up so I dont see the harm in trying to ask for a continuance once.

I was a cop for almost 1/2 my life. with that being said I think it's safe to say I've been around the police dept and traffic court just alittle bit.

especially Highway, AAB (adminstrative, adjudicate board, traffic court) is a priority. vacation days, lost time are denied and you MUST appear!

you got lucky, by law the judge was supposed to re schedule. it's not an automatic dismissal if the cop doesnt show the second time.

you can not be a legal resisdent of 2 states, according to DMV, ( NJ is worse wen it comes to proving resisdense) you have a primary residence and a secondary resisednce ( vacation home). rental properties and businesses dont count. now you might skate through this for a while I'm sure people do, but anyway you slice it dice, twist it and turn it it's insurance fraud.

I pose this question to you and it's purely a senario and I hope and pray it never comes through.

you or a loved on is crossing the street, a car driven by an out of state driver hits you and causes serious injury, posibbly a life altering injury. you hire a lawyer and sue. only to find out the minimum liability dosnt even touch the tip of the iceberg. now the insurance company begins an investigation( Oh they will they hate to pay, but love increasing your rates)
during thier investigation they find the driver/policy holder isnt really a resident of the state they claim, they immediatly notify the court they are taking legal action against thier policy holder for fraud. do you know where that leaves you as a victim? no where.

sorry man the advice you gave was bad advice
I put that right up thier with telling someone to add a couple of drops of bleach in thier reef tank to get clear water

 

[Hitsnorth]

Your wrong about being a legal resident of two states. I was active duty military and according to the law the state I was a resident of before joining was considering my legal state of residence. I owned properties in Virginia and decided to switch my legal residency. I lived in Virginia for years and LEGALLY filed taxes as a Pennsylvania resident up until the point of switching my license.

Ill say this again about the insurance. I NEVER SAID TO GET INSURANCE IN ANOTHER STATE. Look through my posts. Nowhere did I state this. In hindsight I wish I never opened my mouth about it because now I have been accused of a felony and everything I did was under the advice of an attorney and I have no worries whatsoever that what I did was perfectly legal.

As far as postponeing the court date, I have done this twice in my life and both times the judge dismissed it when the officer didnt show up so thats been my experience.

I was a cop for almost 1/2 my life. with that being said I think it's safe to say I've been around the police dept and traffic court just alittle bit.

especially Highway, AAB (adminstrative, adjudicate board, traffic court) is a priority. vacation days, lost time are denied and you MUST appear!

you got lucky, by law the judge was supposed to re schedule. it's not an automatic dismissal if the cop doesnt show the second time.

you can not be a legal resisdent of 2 states, according to DMV, ( NJ is worse wen it comes to proving resisdense) you have a primary residence and a secondary resisednce ( vacation home). rental properties and businesses dont count. now you might skate through this for a while I'm sure people do, but anyway you slice it dice, twist it and turn it it's insurance fraud.

I pose this question to you and it's purely a senario and I hope and pray it never comes through.

you or a loved on is crossing the street, a car driven by an out of state driver hits you and causes serious injury, posibbly a life altering injury. you hire a lawyer and sue. only to find out the minimum liability dosnt even touch the tip of the iceberg. now the insurance company begins an investigation( Oh they will they hate to pay, but love increasing your rates)
during thier investigation they find the driver/policy holder isnt really a resident of the state they claim, they immediatly notify the court they are taking legal action against thier policy holder for fraud. do you know where that leaves you as a victim? no where.

sorry man the advice you gave was bad advice
I put that right up thier with telling someone to add a couple of drops of bleach in thier reef tank to get clear water

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

Im not even sure all states recognize points from another state.

He was talking about getting insurance in Pennsylvania rather then in NJ. I wasnt talking about insurance or getting insurance in another state, I was talking about points on a license. If you have no car insurance this isnt even a factor(I dont have car insurance because I have no car right now so again your assumptions that I was directing him to commit insurance fraud are incorrect)

Since your the link guru please show me some case law that supports your claim that its fraud to turn your license in another state and the points never made it. You think someone should be held liable for flaws in a system? People take advantage of grey areas all the time.

Let me be clear. I am in NO WAY advocating fraud. I was giving advice and you should consult an attorney if you have doubts about it being legal. The fact is when I did it I did consult an attorney and was advised I was NOT doing anything illegal by taking advantage of the system. Please dont accuse me of commiting fraud. The fact is incorrectly accusing someone of fraud is libelous.

Well arguing about LEGAL matters here is usually controversial and yields no results since most of us are not lawyers nor judges.

I have seen many many judges ACD or simply dismiss cases due to technical errors like wrong color of a car summoned-well, but we all know that's the car. That is the judge know that you are guilty but let you go.

On the other hand, legal aids who work with the judges days and night there exploit all the loopholes. I don't want to play judge and say who is in fraud-real judgements are given by real judges and they all know the loopholes and who are taking advantage of it and they also know if the tickets are fraudulant(they are not stupid) and how the law should be interpreted. In a recent case, the court found 75th Precinct gulity of violationg the law by imposing quotas on the fellow NYPD. If there's no crimes in the city, how can you come up with tickets? The judges know the whole thing, most of the time, and they will make the judgement according to their interpretations of the law in a most suitable way for the system to keep rolling. The point here is, the judges also know when the PD is at fraud too and act on some of the cases when they think seriously improper.

So my take, is not to suggest anything but just let the court decide.

We are reef forum. Lets stay put with the reef and the fish.

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

I also request the mod to lock this thread since I think this thread is extremely inappropricate for this forum Manhattan Reefs.

 

[Chiefmcfuz]

I think what Frank is trying to say is like many other things they go hand in hand. You were in the military and yes due to your occupation you had dual residency I agree. However, the topic is getting out of hand. As an active cop for the dept I have traffic court 4-5 times per month, yes you are right the police officer can only reschedule 1 time the second is an automatic dismisal but they are have taken steps to avoid that. They go to the point of changing tours etc to do this. He was also written by a Highway Cop. These guys were, are and always will be at court because if they don't show up they get thrown out of their detail. Trust me they don't want that. Most Highway cops I know take Traffic court very seriously and personally.

Wingnut You're out of your league here. I think you're mixing up words again and you need to rethink the word fraud in your statements. The only ticket fraud that I know of is if someone writes you a ticket without ever pulling you over. 8 years I have never done that. Go get a dictionary and look up the word fraud.

 

[NYPDFrogman]

Your wrong about being a legal resident of two states. I was active duty military and according to the law the state I was a resident of before joining was considering my legal state of residence. I owned properties in Virginia and decided to switch my legal residency. I lived in Virginia for years and LEGALLY filed taxes as a Pennsylvania resident up until the point of switching my license.

Ill say this again about the insurance. I NEVER SAID TO GET INSURANCE IN ANOTHER STATE. Look through my posts. Nowhere did I state this. In hindsight I wish I never opened my mouth about it because now I have been accused of a felony and everything I did was under the advice of an attorney and I have no worries whatsoever that what I did was perfectly legal.

As far as postponeing the court date, I have done this twice in my life and both times the judge dismissed it when the officer didnt show up so thats been my experience.

you never mentioned you were in the military thats the only exception of residing, working in one state and having a license in another.
as far as insurance... if I stopped you for a traffic infraction and youhad all your paper work in order, no attitude I would let you off with a warning.
now if you had a NY registartion, NY insurance and a Pa license bells and whistles would go off. almost every radio car now has a laptop ( when I was on patrol there was one computer car per pct,) a simple name check would reveal your driving history past and present. at that point I'd write you a summons, make proper memo book entries and if need be when in traffic court reveal my findngs. I have yet to have a traffic court lawyer beat me in traffic court. If I wrote you a summoms you derserved it. I never ever went out of my way to write a summons. as I said before I preferred to give a warning rather than a summons, that was just me I cant speak for every cop.

I didnt accuse you of committing fraud I didnt agree with the advice you offered period. as far as your lawyer, I have yet to meet a lawyer with good morals.if you were arrested for your actions do you think he would admit to the court he advised you to do so? sometimes the law isnt cut and dry is it worth all of that for a couple of points on your license that can easily be removed with a defensive driving course???

it's not a personal attack so dont take it as such.
in regards to sav's original post I sent him a PM to get some particulars so I can help him, thats between us

 

[Aqua Pro Builder]

These guys were, are and always will be at court because if they don't show up they get thrown out of their detail. Trust me they don't want that.

Agreed

Wingnut You're out of your league here. I think you're mixing up words again and you need to rethink the word fraud in your statements. The only ticket fraud that I know of is if someone writes you a ticket without ever pulling you over. 8 years I have never done that.

You are good cop, I can tell from your posts.

There are more, like intentionally writting someone up for "no sit belt on" while the engine is off. The judge said that, not me. The judge asked me if the engine is on when the police wrote us the ticket and then tell the PD that "you know you cannot write a "no sit belt on" when the engine is off." My engine was off because the PD told us to. Then, I took off the sit belt to get the documents for him. The whole case was dismissed along with all other summons immediately without further hearing or questioning.

Go get a dictionary and look up the word fraud.

I will and a legal one. Thanks for the reminder.

 

[Savager]

Can someone please lock this thread? I think I got all the help. And I decided to pay for my penalty. I will take defense class and try to reduce my insurance rate.

Changing my license to PA was just a thought I had. And I am too lazy enough to pull it off. So you guys don't have to worry about me breaking the law here. And the insurance thing was my idea and nothing to do with Hitsnorth. And again, I am not going to do it anyway.

Anyway, thanks for you help and please drive safely.

 

[ShaunW]

Done!