Ro/di

[jhale]

Jonathan, I just saw this post, so sorry for the delay.

The combination works great!!! The booster manually is because of its need for electricity. The permeate pump works by the pressure across the RO membrane, so it will always work if water is flowing through the RO/DI unit.

I could imaging not having both pumps, since I also save on water waste since the permeate pump limits the amount of waste water, and booster increases water pressure across the RO membrane.

thanks shaun, do you have a pressure tank? the pressure shut off valve is only $15. it seems to work great for me.

I got the permeate pump specifically to save water, do you think it makes the membrane not last as long?

 

[ShaunW]

No I don't have a pressure tank. I am not sure about the life of the membrane with the permeate pump, but I haven't noticed a difference in the past 1 year using it (my TDS is always 0 out of the RO membrane and out of the DI cartrage).

 

[alrha]

sorry I could not remember what thread you asked that in
everyone who donated will have one, but I think josh has to go through and apply them individually, it's taking some time. you can pm him and say I want my donor button. we are also waiting for the blue variation to be made, I'm not sure where the orange came from, so maybe he's waiting to get the correct ones from the artist before he posts them all. do not worry you will not be forgotten.

I asked it in THIS thread. sheeesh, some moderator, let me tell you. he he, j/k.

ok, well i sure donated, so i guess it is just a matter of time till it comes...

 

[jhale]

I know, it was a long day.
I try my best really

 

[purelyh2o]

Cool Board guys!

Hey Guys its Bryan from purely h2o John threw me the link!

Just wanted to say hello and hey John I would like to Sponsor the board throw me some details.

Bryan Crenshaw

 

[ShaunW]

WELCOME TO MANHATTANREEFS, glad you joined us, .

 

[jhale]

i dont do eBay, dont even have an account.
it is complicated to set-up? it looks like you just put the water in one side, out the other and plug it in. is there more to it?

that's it for the pump, you need something to regulate it, other wise it will never shut off. if you are only feeding your ro reservoir you could put in a latching float switch. when the water level drops to a certain level the pump is turned on, the when it gets to the top of the container it shuts off.

as a back up I would recommend a plastic float valve.

no ebay?

 

[jhale]

Hey Guys its Bryan from purely h2o John threw me the link!

Just wanted to say hello and hey John I would like to Sponsor the board throw me some details.

Bryan Crenshaw

Hey Bryan good to see you here! I'll have Josh Saul get in touch with you, he handles the sponsors.

 

[alrha]

that's it for the pump, you need something to regulate it, other wise it will never shut off. if you are only feeding your ro reservoir you could put in a latching float switch. when the water level drops to a certain level the pump is turned on, the when it gets to the top of the container it shuts off.

as a back up I would recommend a plastic float valve.

no ebay?

i have the Kent Marine float valve (still never intalled it, but i have it, and will have to do it already). the Drs F&S site shows that it works with a float valve. but i wonder how it will shut, perhaps i need to get a float switch to shut the power when the garbage can is full?

 

[jhale]

do you mean the black plastic float valve?
that will stop the water from coming in the container,
but your right, you can't hook it up to the pump,
you need an electronic float switch for that.

 

[FRY]

johathan how you makeing out with the ro system

frank

 

[jhale]

it's working well. this weekend I'm going to try and hook up all the valves.
I'll put up some pics of the leads. I think I'll need some help.

 

[Unresistible Blue]

i change the sediment filter when i notice decreased flow rates.
i change the carbon filter when i see it clogged (orange).
the DI is supposedly supposed to change color when exhausted, i never saw it change color, but changed it after one year as well as the RO membrane.

my tap water tests at ~45 TDS and my RO/DI tests at ~1 TDS.

A good rule of thumb is to replace your sediment filter and carbon block after six months. A more precise way to maximize the useable life of these two filters is to use a pressure gauge to identify when pressure reaching the membrane starts to decline. This is your indication one or both of the filers is beginning to clog.

Also be cognizant of the chlorine capacity of the carbon block. The Matrikx+1 for example will remove >90% of chlorine from 20,000 gallons of tap water presented at 1 gpm. Original equipment suppliers commonly provide carbon cartridges rated at 2,000 to 6,000 gallons.

Regarding your RO membrane and DI resin, use your TDS meter to measure, record, and track the tds (expressed in parts per million) in three places:
1. Tap water
2. After the RO but before the DI
3. After the DI.

The TDS in your tap water will likely range from about 50 ppm to upwards of 1000 ppm. Common readings are 100 to 400. So for sake of discussion, let's say your tap water reads 400. That means that for every million parts of water, you have 400 parts of dissolved solids.

How do we go about getting that TDS reading down to somewhere near zero?

If you do some experimenting with your TDS meter, you'll note that your sediment filter and carbon block filter do very little to remove dissolved solids. So with your tap water at 400 ppm, you can measure the water at the "in" port on your RO housing and you'll see its still approximately 400 ppm.

The RO membrane is really the workhorse of the system. It removes most of the TDS, some membranes to a greater extent than others. For instance, 100 gpd Filmtec membranes have a rejection rate of 90% (i.e., they reject 90% of the dissolved solids in feed water). So the purified water coming from your 100 gpd membrane would be about 40 ppm (a 90% reduction). Filmtec 75 gpd (and below) membranes produce less permeate, but have a higher rejection rate (98%).

If you measure the TDS in your system after the RO membrane, and before the DI housing, you'll be able to measure the rejection rate of your membrane. A declining rejection rate is a good way to tell when your membrane needs to be replaced.

After the RO membrane, water will flow to your DI housing. DI resin in good condition will reduce the 40 ppm water down to 0 or 1 ppm. When the DI output starts creeping up from 0 or 1 ppm to 3 ppm, 5 ppm, and higher, you know that your resin needs to be replaced.

Sometimes people complain that their DI resin didn't last very long. Usually the culprit is a malfunctioning RO membrane sending the DI resin "dirty" water. This will exhaust the resin quicker then would otherwise have been the case.

 

[Unresistible Blue]

Dean you are correct RO/DI is probably what you shouldn't drink, but I guess it all depends on how much solutes have been taken out of the water by the RO.

I think that the "flavor enhancer" probably buffers the water back to pH 7 using different salts.

"Flavor enhancer" cartridges are typically granular activated carbon.

 

[Unresistible Blue]

why not install di filter between 4 gal pressurized tank and solenoid valve,the tank incress pressure when its full and that whould force more water pressure thur di filter its worth a try

frank

A check valve should be installed to prevent water flowing from the pressure tank back through the DI. Too much water going through the DI cart too quickly = reduced contact time = reduced treatment.

 

[Unresistible Blue]

I've read that as well, but what if the water is going to fast for the filter to be effective, wouldn't the second filter catch what the first one misses.

this is assuming that water coming out of the tank is pushed through the DI filter faster than it's supposed to be.

You're on the right track. Two DI carts increase the contact time. Not generally required for a typical set-up, but likely necessary if you're sending pressure tank water backwards through the DI.

 

[Unresistible Blue]

so to prevent this can you put a restrictor in line before the DI filter.
I've seen restrictors for psi ratings, I'm not sure if I've seen them in gph.

I think you meant a check valve, rather than a flow restrictor.

A flow restrictor reduces flow in the waste line after the RO housing.

 

[House of Laughter]

UB,

Nice reply (#133)

But in order to do what you say (test RO verses DI) you have to have an RO bypass installed on your unit, or you have to plumb it yourself, OR you have to take the hose off to the DI cart and measure. Many of the people here buy off ebay and those units are not typically made with this feature.

When I bought mine, I had the vendor install the RO bypass becuase it made perfect sense (as you noted) to test the RO water verses the DI in order to check cart health.

Although, I disagree with the 6 month replacement policy. Where I live we have town water which reads 270tds from tap, 90tds from Brita 5tds from RO and 0tds from RO/DI. I bought my 4 stage unit in June 2003. about 6 months ago I purchased a full set of cartridges (include the TFC membrane) and still get 6tds from my RO bypass. That was 2 years ago!

On a side note, thanks for joining in for this forum, Welcome to Manhattan Reefs and appreciate your expertise and helping local reefers out.

House

 

[jhale]

welcome to the board UB, good advice.

putting a valve before and after the RO membrane is pretty simple, just cut the tube and stick a valve in where ever you want.

I'm thinking of adding a DI canister to take the place of the current post filters I'm using. The only reason is to house more DI so I don't have to change it so often.
Does anyone have any preferences for DI canisters.
I'd like to get a taller 20" one and pack it with a ton of DI.

 

[House of Laughter]

I don't know much abour Unresistable blue, but in this thread that JH posted, he posted some really good advise - and correct too

Deanos, you may want to drop them a line to see what's up.

House