Apex / Genesis

[exoticar]

For everyone that has an Apex, I pose this to the more advanced. after quite a bit of research on controllers, I am going for the Apex. My question for the more advanced or not so advanced, I really like the Genesis Renewal system. With all the programable capabilities of the Apex, is it possible to program the Apex to function as the Genesis does? Also to shut down the power to a Tunze ATO as the auto water change occurs? Just a note as far as water sources and drains. my filter/sump room is a former bathroom converted, so there is ample drainage. Also i use a 55 gal drum for my DI RO, and another for salt water. Automating water changes is a great concept, but 500 for an apex, and another 400 for the Genesis, wow

 

[thirty5]

Yes it can.. There is another thread about it.

I am going to look into it when i get my Apex.

http://www.manhattanreefs.com/forum/general-discussion/112414-water-changes.html

 

[reefs4life]

I have something that I am experimenting with on my Apex and if done correctly it should work very much like a Genesis RENEW. Although, instead of 1 gallon metering buckets I'll have 5 gallon ones since I have a larger set up. I will keep you updated on this. If I'm successful I think I'll do a write-up as well.

 

[cryptics]

BTLDReef created something like this (without the APEX) for like $70 or so. He details it in the DIY section I have to get him to come over and set it up for me

 

[noelskii]

looking for more ways to crash tanks, i guess...

 

[Josh]

I have both the Apex and the Genesis. There is NO WAY you are going to replicate the entire Genesis design with the Apex. There is a lot more in the system than turning on/off pumps and monitoring float switches. There are so many things that can go wrong, if you try and insure against all of them you will spend more money than the cost of the Genesis.

I know the Renew is an expensive product but it has many design features that you are not thinking about, those features come from lots of testing and lessons learned.

 

[cryptics]

Can you give me an example? I don't mind spending the money if it is worth it but I can't think of what else it would do as a check? siphon breaks maybe?

 

[Josh]

The way the standpipes are built within the metering reservoirs ensures that you cannot overfill a bucket and cause a flood.

How can you perfectly meter 1g with aquarium pumps? Will you be doing multiple 1g changes or one huge change at once? How do you ensure that your sump pump does not run dry?

 

[thirty5]

I wish I was lucky enough to get a demo to use

 

[exoticar]

how do you fill the metering buckets? the way i have my setup and was thinking of direct pumping. I would have one pump in my 50 gal saltwater container, and the out going directly into a drain. my system is approx 400 gallons, so i was thinking about 10 gallon weekly change. First automatically removing 10 gal from the sump, then 10 gal of new pumped in.

 

[exoticar]

i would just need to figure out how much time an mj600 or 1200 pumps 10 gallons, and a way to turn off my tunze ato while this process is occuring.

 

[thirty5]

I am with you on this.. But it is not as easy as it sounds... I think that you would need to have some sort of timer that actually turns on one pump then have it fill a container where you can set a float switch to be exact amount. Then some sort of solenoid to empty that container into sink.

Then the same exact thing for the new SW. I think that the hardest part is making sure that you are really doing the exact amount. I would not work on timing the flow, many things can effect flow on the pump. You really need some sort of floats to actually measure the water.

 

[Josh]

How will you know that the bucket emptied properly? What if a float switch gets stuck in the off position?

 

[thirty5]

I am with you Josh there are tons of variables... Would need tons of switches as failsafes.

 

[reefs4life]

I'm building my own "Genesis-like" system with my apex and it follows the genesis pretty much in the same way, once I'm done you'll see you can easily do it with the apex for less than 100 bucks. On top of it all, I'm making it to fit my large attend so instead of 1 gallon metering buckets I'll be using 5 gallon ones. Just wait and see

Sent from my HTC Sensation 4G using Reefs

 

[Josh]

I am with you Josh there are tons of variables... Would need tons of switches as failsafes.

If you wanted to follow the genesis design you would place a standpipe above the top float so there is no risk of a flood.

Keep in mind the Renew has 2 buckets, each has 2 floats and one solenoid. You also need floats for the makeup bucket and sump. The cost will add up rather quickly.

 

[Josh]

I'm making it to fit my large attend so instead of 1 gallon metering buckets I'll be using 5 gallon ones. Just wait and see

Keep in mind if you take 5g from your sump you will most likely run the sump very low and the return pump will suck air. How will you handle that?

 

[reefoman]

How will you know that the bucket emptied properly? What if a float switch gets stuck in the off position?

If you worry about that you can get optical water sensor, is nothing better on the market than that. All new dishwashers using those sensors and water boilers, especially steam boilers. How to adjust one gallon?
It's easy... I can adjust even one quart of gallon.
I have one sensor extra even to protect my protein skimmer, if for some reason the water volume in my sump gonna go up 1/2" it will turn off my skimmer and that work already when my durso pipe some how pops out from the bulkhead.

 

[exoticar]

i have a 100 gal sump. both outlets to the skimmer and the circ pump are on the bottom of the sump.

 

[reefs4life]

Keep in mind if you take 5g from your sump you will most likely run the sump very low and the return pump will suck air. How will you handle that?

Already tested, I have a 120 gallon sump, my return sections I'm guestimating holds about 8 gallons, I took 5 out and pump was more than ok