Jarrett Sharks New 220gal Office Tank

[Solace Aquatics LLC]

The Hammerhead is 1 1/2 on both sides.



I'm assuming this is a joke. There are certainly enough proper tank builds of well over the 200 gallon mark that use power heads, unless you consider Tunze and Vortechs something else. The link earlier is a 1200 using 8 Vortechs. Large pumps cannot match the GPH a pair of normal Tunze's can do and at 1/10th the electric. From a DR standpoint I can power a single Tunze/Vortech for hours on a small battery, to do the same with a Hammerhead would require a room of batteries.

Just my opinion but the old ways of thinking large single pumps are wrong, I can protect my system from power/pump/heater failures a lot easier going modular. Why would we not build our systems without taking this into account?

+1

In most of the large of builds I have done, I do use one large to pump to power the main returns and accesories ie. Ca Reactors, Media Reactors, etc. However, circulation within the tank is usually based on a system of Vortechs or similar utilizing a battery Backup should the power ever go down. Remember tank turn over is not just limited to water going down the overflows and through the sump.

I think you are on a good path. I would however recommend using 2 - 7" Filter Socks at one time. I also recommend a stock in them so that you can keep several clean so that they be changed out in an instant.

Good Luck! Looking forward to see how the build goes!

 

[cali_reef]

If you use both of the holes in the tank as drains that would give you 1 1/2" more drain.. Then you will be able to get a pump that can do hammerhead gph..

So two 3/4" holes added together will provide the same flow rate as a 1.5 inch hole?

 

[henrystyle]

+1

In most of the large of builds I have done, I do use one large to pump to power the main returns and accesories ie. Ca Reactors, Media Reactors, etc. However, circulation within the tank is usually based on a system of Vortechs or similar utilizing a battery Backup should the power ever go down. Remember tank turn over is not just limited to water going down the overflows and through the sump.

I think you are on a good path. I would however recommend using 2 - 7" Filter Socks at one time. I also recommend a stock in them so that you can keep several clean so that they be changed out in an instant.

Good Luck! Looking forward to see how the build goes!

+2....Never rely on just your main return pump for all your flow inside your tank. If the power goes out for a long time, you will come home to everything dead in your tank....Always have a powerhead/vortech hooked up to a backup battery supply just in case. Gotta keep the water surface moving. Have you guys ever thought of plumbing the overflow so that it goes directly into the skimmer? Logic being 100% of the overflow water will get skimmed, not just a portion of it from the sump.. Filter socks suck in my opinion...They need to be cleaned to often. Would a bubble trap take care of the micro bubbles? Skimmer-bubble trap-maybe rdsb-return pump???

 

[Bob 1000]

Long story short.. Big return pump, multiple returns is how I have done a lot of systems. I also run adequate electricity to the system.. I don't like powerheads,,my opinion.. I have kept some of the most hard to keep species of inverts,,, alive by not having powerheads.. I have a video I will try to upload of a symbiotic pair emperor shrimp and a form of cucumber that I could not have kept with powerheads..

Qy7400 I'm dead serious the water flow in my tank is crazy.. I just don't like powerheads an dwould rather one or maybe 2 plugs for pumps.. I keep sps and am very good at it.. I do this for a living and think I'm doing really good, seriously.. The systems I build are done right and if it came down to no power for 4 days I'd have more life in my tank than most of the people here.. I have and the systems that work on have 02 reactors that most people don't even know about..

Calireef I'm saying an extra 1 1/2" drain will allow him to run a larger pump because he will have more drainage.. So turning 2 of the 2 holes in the little box in the back of the tank will aloow more water to go down,, down to the sump.... Drainage..

Henrystyle if you do that will that be enough gph for the skimmer??? I didn't think that would do it.. Also is Vortech giving you a kick back,,lol..

 

[Bob 1000]

Oh yeah, the last way of thinking over here is the old way... When I say a single pump that does the job I'm not just letting it all ride on this pump... I have other means that I have posted for you guys to learn about of having stability and system security..
If my electric were to go, my 02 levels would remain stable, allowing the fish to swim allowing water movement.. Light is the only thing that would kill my system..

 

[JARRETT SHARK]

what about my questions not answered

My 1) question to you is if I change the filters socks and have micro bubbels for a minute or two is it going to be a problem?
2) If i would go with a bigger pump would it be a waiste to reduce from a 2''at pump to 1'' in basement to 3/4 at tank. would I lose alot of flow this way? I have a 5500 gal pump from my pond that I could use for a test but its not a head pressuure pump, also so might not see the effects cause of this.

My problem is that it might be hard to go behind the tank like you said at this point with bigger returns because the tank is agaist the wall.

My sump is only 5 feet away from the tank and 10' in height I have to go. I have ok flow now with the pan world pump but was looking for alot more in case I had dead spots in the tank. my sump.

I could always add a sump if I had to. Also the skimmer is going to discharge in a filter sock.

thanks

 

[henrystyle]

Oh yeah, the last way of thinking over here is the old way... When I say a single pump that does the job I'm not just letting it all ride on this pump... I have other means that I have posted for you guys to learn about of having stability and system security..
If my electric were to go, my 02 levels would remain stable, allowing the fish to swim allowing water movement.. Light is the only thing that would kill my system..

I bet your talking about the german sochting oxygenator. Thats cool but the majority of people on here dont even know what that is...Truth is, if the power goes out on a heavily stocked tank, the oxygen levels will be depleted very quickly.
Plus if this happens in the summer months it will deplete even faster. Warmer water hold less oxygen. You still need power..Your fish aren't gonna move your water for you....IMO..

 

[henrystyle]

what about my questions not answered

My 1) question to you is if I change the filters socks and have micro bubbels for a minute or two is it going to be a problem?
2) If i would go with a bigger pump would it be a waiste to reduce from a 2''at pump to 1'' in basement to 3/4 at tank. would I lose alot of flow this way? I have a 5500 gal pump from my pond that I could use for a test but its not a head pressure pump, also so might not see the effects cause of this.

1-micro bubbles are not a problem. It wont hurt anything in your tank. Its just that it messes up your view of your tank..Most people dont like to see bubbles in there reef tank.
2- It is a waste and you will kill your flow. You never want to reduce line until you get to the end of the line. IMO. maybe Im wrong but I know many people who have run into problem reducing there pvc lines. Someone correct me if Im wrong.

 

[qy7400]

Bob….never said one large pump wouldn’t work only disagreed with it and that power heads wouldn’t work in large tanks. While I’ll agree that power heads may look unsightly you can hide them in the rockwork and place them where they are no more obtrusive than loc-line. The electric comment was aimed at efficient use, both a Hammerhead (@ 0’) and a pair of Tunze 6125 will move around 6K GPH; only the Tunzes will use 50W of power next to the 350W the Reeflow uses.<o></o>
<o></o>
Jarret sorry we strayed off topic…<o></o>
<o></o>
Micro bubbles are no problem, if you’re ever at Atlantis watch the surge tank when it discharges; the right side is flooded with them.<o></o>
I would avoid reducing the return from 2” to 1”, if you can bring the 2” as far as you can and then build a manifold for the ?” to go into the tank you'd be better served.<o></o>

 

[JARRETT SHARK]

thanks.

this might sound stupid, since I have 2 pan world pumps can I put one pump on the left return and one pump on the right return.
Just real tight on funds now and until I find a hammerhead pump and I want to get going asap.will they fight each other?

My next thing is am thinking about is Bobs idea of using all 4 holes in the tank for drainage and find a way to get bigger 1 1/2 pipe thru my already finshed wall that the tank is against.

 

[qy7400]

As long as the pumps share the sump you'll be fine, this would only be an issue if the left and right had their own sump.

If memory serves all 4 drains will not keep up with a Hammerhead, 1" pipe can handle around 600GPH and 3/4" around 340GPH when using gravity; so each overflow will peek and under 1K GPH. I would not go this route unless you have dual 2" drains and modified the teeth on the overflow as well.

 

[Solace Aquatics LLC]

Jarrret,
Stick with the plan you have. It sounds like a solid build.

The rule of thumb is 10X turnover. As I have said earlier, this does not mean 10X through your sump and plumbing.

Another reason not to go with 1 major return pump is you will you always have to be stuck using lock-line (which is just as ugly IMO) and will not be able to create different water patterns unless you install an Ocean Motion or similar. If it is in your budget and you do end up going over the back with your return plumbing, you might want to consider using Wavy Sea Modules. By using the Vortechs, you will be able to create Random Water Patterns (which is OPTIMAL for ALL inverts).

Of course the last reason, which already has been argued over and over again is what if the power goes down, but no one seemed to mention that any Pump that has a Centrifugal Impeller such as the Hammerhead will clog (eventually) and will need maintenance, which takes more than 10 miutes, trust me on that, I have used MANY Reeflo pumps, during that time your tank will not have any surface movement and CO2 and carbonic acids will build up, not to mention any toxins created by the bacteria in your tank.

Plus, water rushing through a sump is not an ideal path, because it does not give the water time to react with the air, not to mention if the sump is not baffled correctly, the dreaded micro-bubble issue.

I believe you are on the right path. You will get more than enough water movement in the tank with the Vortechs and will have more than enough turnover using the 2 Panworlds.

As I said earlier, order yourself a bunch of filter socks as you do not want to have to keep pulling them out of the system, rinsing them, and then putting them back. Way too annoying.

If you keep a good supply of filter socks you can do what I and many members on the board do. Turn them inside out, use about a table or a dab more of bleach, and throw them in the clothes washer on HOT with an additional rinse cycle. It also helps keep the filter socks open (like open grit sandpaper) which will allow them to filter like new every time you put them back in the tank.

Stick with your plan. If you plumb it correctly now by using True Unions in the Proper places, you can always switch out pumps and sumps later down the line if need be.

 

[cali_reef]

thanks.

this might sound stupid, since I have 2 pan world pumps can I put one pump on the left return and one pump on the right return.
Just real tight on funds now and until I find a hammerhead pump and I want to get going asap.will they fight each other?

My next thing is am thinking about is Bobs idea of using all 4 holes in the tank for drainage and find a way to get bigger 1 1/2 pipe thru my already finshed wall that the tank is against.

Don't believe anyone that tells you two 3/4" holes will provide the same flow rate as a single 1.5" hole, they don't know their math :lol:.

http://www.panworldamericas.com/pdf/pan world brochure.pdf

Based on the flow chart in their catalog for a 250PS, I would use only one as the return pump as it should get you about 1,600 gallons at 15 feet of head pressure. Using pvc pipes larger than that of the pump discharge port will reduce friction and provide easier flow path, but at some point the larger sizes becomes a burden on the pump and sump capacity. Ideally, I would use 1.25" vertical and horizontal PVC runs to the bottom of the tank than split the flow and reduce to 3/4", use of spaflex for the turns if you can.

You might have to widen out the teeth on the stock megaflow boxes as they are very restrictive.

 

[Bob 1000]

what about my questions not answered

My 1) question to you is if I change the filters socks and have micro bubbels for a minute or two is it going to be a problem?
2) If i would go with a bigger pump would it be a waiste to reduce from a 2''at pump to 1'' in basement to 3/4 at tank. would I lose alot of flow this way? I have a 5500 gal pump from my pond that I could use for a test but its not a head pressuure pump, also so might not see the effects cause of this.

My problem is that it might be hard to go behind the tank like you said at this point with bigger returns because the tank is agaist the wall.

My sump is only 5 feet away from the tank and 10' in height I have to go. I have ok flow now with the pan world pump but was looking for alot more in case I had dead spots in the tank. my sump.

I could always add a sump if I had to. Also the skimmer is going to discharge in a filter sock.

thanks

Agree with Henrystyles answer. I have 1 1/2 in. out the pump when I get to my tank it goes down to 3/4 with eductor on the end.. Works great.. also have 3 1 1/2" drains..

 

[Bob 1000]

I bet your talking about the german sochting oxygenator. Thats cool but the majority of people on here dont even know what that is...Truth is, if the power goes out on a heavily stocked tank, the oxygen levels will be depleted very quickly.
Plus if this happens in the summer months it will deplete even faster. Warmer water hold less oxygen. You still need power..Your fish aren't gonna move your water for you....IMO..

Yes I use a socting oxydator.. As far as heavily stocked in the summer oxygen levels will deplete quicker but I will just add more of the liquid.. I'm well aware that warmer water holds less oxygen... As far as the oxdator goes.. It will hold the tank for 3.5 days I know from experience... I kept a 6.5" mahi mahi in my 300 gallon for that long with no water movement and fed it heavily for these days.. I really know what I'm talking about.. For the first time in probably history I will post the video.. I dids ploace3 power heads in for a breif time but forgot to plug them back in and noticed 3 days later,,,my bad fishy.. But he did well.. This fish is a serious swimmer and needs oxygen..

 

[JARRETT SHARK]

will be trying the 2 pumps for return into the tank first and if not good result will go with you idea bob of behind the tanks and use all 4 drainage lines.
will see tonight!!!!!!!!!

 

[A&V.REEFS]

hey jarrett what kind of sharks r u looking for

 

[JARRETT SHARK]

please do not on ask me that on this thread dude? its a tank thread not want to buy thread.
you could pm me for that stuff!

 

[JARRETT SHARK]

Today was a good day, installed both pumps for the return to the tank, One pump for each side of the tank. Now I have good flow!! I also installed one sea swirl on one side and on the other side I used to have it come out to two 3/4 Loc-lines and reduced it to One with a Flare Nozzel now. I guess this was the problem and I can;t wait to install the 2 Vortechs vp40's.
Also how do you know if there is to much flow going thru your fuge?

Let my build start again!!!!!!!!!!

 

[henrystyle]

Also how do you know if there is to much flow going thru your fuge?

Let my build start again!!!!!!!!!!

???When everything is blowing all over the place......Refugiums normally have a calm flow through it so that it you doesnt disturb all the critters and macro algae in there.