Thoughts on National Coral Registry

[Len]

http://nationalcoralregistry.com/

 

[jamesw]

It's the American Kennel Club or the hobby? So that people can charge more for corals that come w/ "papers?"

Cheers
James

 

[Anonymous]

Looks like some people who spent way too much for corals are upset that they lose their value if they grow or heaven for bid more of that same species and same/similar color morph magically appear in the ocean (What you say there wasn't only one of those in the entire world???). Or its some hair brained money making scheme which it sounds like since you'll probably have to pay to register a coral, and it mentions an auction site (which I'm sure they'll get a piece of everything).

enefit greatly by enjoying an authentic and stabilized market by retaining the authenticity of their genuine LE Corals.

The genuine LE corals? Guess what if it exists in other forms, it's not so Limited is it!

I mean seriously, you could have a "True" Limited Edition Tyree Whatever that was gotten personally from a disciple of Jesus! (the reefer not the other one ), and chances are it won't look exactly the same in your tank than it did his.

Sorry, this is a sore subject with me, these are animals, yes some are more desirable than others but to label something as "limited" when its something that grows and can be cut and those cuttings can be grown is just plain silly.

 

[Len]

I've got no problem with ensuring pedigree. I know collector's want to verify lineage, whether or not it really matters.

I'm just not sure how this site would enforce/validate anything. And although I'm not clear on the exact business model yet, it appears more like a for-profit business then a service to hobbyists.

 

[Anonymous]

appears more like a for-profit business then a service to hobbyists.

That is what I walked away with as well.

 

[Anonymous]

There is just no information on process. Who are they? How are corals named? Registered? Tracked? Cost?

 

[Ben1]

I was at my LFS this week and he was complaining how all the naming is ruining the hobby. He was saying all his distributers are starting to charge double what the used to by slapping names on colonys that used to be just sold as zoa colony now all are flame thower this and that driving his cost up. He said even some of the collectors are starting to do it right from the islands to jack the price up. A registry would be a fun gimmick for those of us that have bought certain LE pieces and when you sell frags you know everyone wants to know lineage, otherwise they dont beleive its the real deal. Someone could just as easy start a forum for lineage and let it be free. I have never bought a coral just because it was an LE, but becuase I liked the way a certain LE looked, held color, and grew in captive. Getting random named corals come in is like a gamble on how they are going to do in captivity over time. I am sure we will see this registry as just an extra way to jack price up, "Registered my miami one eye only $2k" lol.

 

[jamesw]

I like this quote from the announcement:

"“We will be providing an invaluable service to hobbyists,” said Burnham “When someone buys an eye of coral at prices that can go as high as $1000 or more it is important to know the lineage of the coral you are purchasing and that it is authentic.”"

I didn't know that corals have eyes - I thought they had polyps????

No but seriously - people like Sanjay, myself, Bob, Rich, etc have been trading frags for decades. It would be really cool to know who has them now and how they are doing. Just last week I got a frag back from a Porites colony that I owned almost 10 years ago!

But to me it has nothing to do w/ price. I think corals frags should pretty much be traded and "banked" for free.

Cheers
James

 

[Anonymous]

I like this quote from the announcement:

"“We will be providing an invaluable service to hobbyists,” said Burnham “When someone buys an eye of coral at prices that can go as high as $1000 or more it is important to know the lineage of the coral you are purchasing and that it is authentic.”"

I didn't know that corals have eyes - I thought they had polyps????

No but seriously - people like Sanjay, myself, Bob, Rich, etc have been trading frags for decades. It would be really cool to know who has them now and how they are doing. Just last week I got a frag back from a Porites colony that I owned almost 10 years ago!

But to me it has nothing to do w/ price. I think corals frags should pretty much be traded and "banked" for free.

Cheers
James

James eye=coralite He is talking about "chalices" in that case, not SPS

agreed on the trading part though. Our local club has a Don't Break The Chain program (PIF - DBTC) that is highly successful ... http://www.bareefers.org/home/node/13

 

[Unarce]

I enjoyed the coral-naming and collecting for a bit...but it is pretty silly now. The LPS and zoa trade has really FUBAR'd that part of the hobby :lol:

 

[trido]

agreed on the trading part though. Our local club has a Don't Break The Chain program (PIF - DBTC) that is highly successful ... http://www.bareefers.org/home/node/13

So successful that clubs across the country are copying it almost to the letter. The PSAS of Seattle is one of them.


This lineage program looks like it will price guys like me right out of obtaining some corals.
One possible scenario is the new Seattle mummy eye chalice that is selling for eighty an eye with three eye minimum. If its suddenly registered and the owner needs to make up a registry cost. The price will go up due to that first, then who knows how much because its registered. I likely wont stand a chance to trade a buddy for a piece of anything I have, without paying at least something. He is probably going to want to trade for something registered, or money to help pay back the original registry fee.

Looks like a way to jack up the prices of an already expensive hobby even more. JMO

 

[Anonymous]

The plan is in action then The hope was it would catch like wildfire. A ton of other clubs have joined in. Ours is to the point it's hard to give corals away :lol: Even highly sought after ones else where. Future holds clubs trading with each other I suppose. BAR did it once with Manhattan Reefs and that worked pretty good.

 

[trido]

The plan is in action then The hope was it would catch like wildfire. A ton of other clubs have joined in. Ours is to the point it's hard to give corals away :lol: Even highly sought after ones else where. Future holds clubs trading with each other I suppose. BAR did it once with Manhattan Reefs and that worked pretty good.

We hope to get to that point. Our program as well as our forum is young, but in good time it will happen.

 

[Anonymous]

Well like most anything in this hobby, good things never go quick

 

[NatlCoralRegistry]

Hi Guys, sorry I haven't been on for a bit, just busy registering coral. Alot of people are taking things way out of context or trying to read something extra into it. I am not driving prices up , just providing a service that makes sure you get what you pay for. There are lots of names for the same corals sometimes but there are also lots of look alikes that aren't quite the real deal. there are too many people that see something in their tank and go look! its just like xxxx's piece so my piece my piece is a xxxx abc.
If I pay for a nice Atlantis or other farmers coral I would like to know thats what it is and also what to expect.As soon as the website is running it will go along way to dispell some of the smoke here.There is no conspiracy ! One of the nice features on the site is lots of ways for the buyers to find the nice coral and not have to run around looking without finding that desired piece.The interested parties will be able to go through the Hall of Fame and see the original namer, the corals care and dietary needs, and how to link up with the person or persons selling. There is also a really nice auction site that will be the premier spot for sellers and buyers. One of the frustrating things in my mind is to buy a piece of coral thats kind of like a rare baseball card then in 6 months it has been reduced to a give away piece thats not worth a tenth of what I paid for it.When the people that bring these corals in, they spend literally thousands of dollars to get a transship order and the payoff is usually one or two crazy nice pieces that end up having to sell for what the importer basically paid for the whole order because you just can't get a good buck off of the stuff everyone already has.So back to basics. It costs nothing to register a colony right now.When I do close the open registration it will be 20 bucks. There is no charge for the certificates to go with the selling corals.period. the buyer will have a 6.00 reg. fee. I think with the amount of time it takes to import the info and send out the registrations 6.00 is almost a giveaway.There are also custom frag plugs available with embedded reg. numbers that will also protect the buyer and seller. This whole thing is just to answer the burning question everyone on all the boards is asking right now. "Do you have lineage?"When you buy coral thats NCRA registered you are certain to get what you pay for . A certain coral from a certain farmer. not a maybe , or my friend got it from a friend , who traded with a guy from LA who bought his piece from a guy that knows someone that knows someone.Its all very simple. Also there will be a DNA certification that is available to the farmer but I don't expect it to be used very often, just extreme high dollar cases. We use custom software to track the coral registrations and also supply a very nice certificate back to the farmer.My web builder is killing me since the go live date was Dec.1 but it should be any day now.Its a very complex site to have built . If there are any other questions I haven't answered please contact me at my personal email. [email protected]. I will do my best to answer your question and make sure its all black and white. One of the things the NCRA is being built on is integrity. absolute integrity. We are currently making plans to get out to a lot of the big shows coming up and meeting everyone in person.I look forward to your emails so please don't hold back. If you think there are loop holes or grey areas please point them out. This is a pretty bullet proof process but just like anything in the world there is always room for improvement and I am welcome to suggestions. Happy reefing you guys and lets all have a Merry Christmas and Super New Year.
Brent

 

[Anonymous]

Hey Brent!

:welcome:


Are you doing anything to encourage accurate taxonomy, or are you accepting common names?

Is there any process or certification for registering a coral or is it all up to the person registering? In other words how do you assure the buyer that the seller is accurate in their claims of lineage?

What about imports that are indeed the same coral? For instance, there really are new imports that are the same as the 'true undata'.

Can you tell us more about the DNA testing you mentioned?

Thanks!

 

[Anonymous]

Hey Brent!

:welcome:


Are you doing anything to encourage accurate taxonomy, or are you accepting common names?

Is there any process or certification for registering a coral or is it all up to the person registering? In other words how do you assure the buyer that the seller is accurate in their claims of lineage?

What about imports that are indeed the same coral? For instance, there really are new imports that are the same as the 'true undata'.

Can you tell us more about the DNA testing you mentioned?

Thanks!

Along the same lines, would DNA testing actually prove a True Undata LE is that very coral or would it simply tell you it's a M. undata? I suspect the latter myself

 

[NatlCoralRegistry]

Hey Brent!

:welcome:


Are you doing anything to encourage accurate taxonomy, or are you accepting common names?

Is there any process or certification for registering a coral or is it all up to the person registering? In other words how do you assure the buyer that the seller is accurate in their claims of lineage?

What about imports that are indeed the same coral? For instance, there really are new imports that are the same as the 'true undata'.

Can you tell us more about the DNA testing you mentioned?

Thanks!

the taxonomy falls on the farmer. to get a true ID I would have to have a piece of the skeleton. This registry isn't about what the coral is, its more about tracking the lineage and making sure that if it says farmer A's Acan then it will have lineage to Farmer A. People can't reg a coral and claim it came from someone. If its unregistered then that person becomes ground zero for tracking lineage. If someone registers a coral under one genus and then finds out later its different then they would email us and it gets corrected in the records immediately. We do our best to maintain accurate and true info. We are pretty good at visual ID's and if someone submits something like say an Acanthastrea Lordhowensis and its Acanthastrea Bowerbanki we will point it out. Alot of people are banging the drum about silliness naming corals but alot of people aren't interested in learning the names. Without names people can pull out of their head it will be back to , oh yeah its a purple stick or yellow polyp. Some of the names do go a little over the top but it still serves a purpose.To minimize a corals papers being used on another coral there is a stipulation. Once the number has been recorded there is a sixty day clock on it. This gives the buyer time to stablize his coral before going on with any type of register. If he forgets to register within this window , the window gets a little smaller. The person at this point has to get the original seller to validate the coral . Once the seller emails the validity of the coral it can be registered. This option closes at the six month mark.It is going to take a little effort on our part but everthing should run straight and true back to the farmer. The DNA question is being worked out as we type this. Basically the farmer will have to submit a sample of the coral and pay a small fee to have a DNA profile registered.Somebody a few posts back said this will be the AKC of coral and thats hardly the case. The AKC does nothing for the breeder for the buyer other than make money and send out papers.There are so many things in this that make the public and farmers interactive , that alone makes NCRA unique.Through our database and ancestry software a person will be able to have confidence they are getting what they bargain for and not something else. Keep the questions coming everyone BrentB

 

[Anonymous]

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[Anonymous]

So ummm, unless Steve Tyree (or the people he got the corals from) comes forward to use your service all Tyree corals won't be "registered"?