40g too small for a newbie?

[igoRluse]

Here I was late at night surfing looking for information and dreaming about that 200g tank that I was going to buy in a few months when suddenly I had the greatest idea. One of my wife's solid oak cabinets would be a great spot to put a tank and would only require a few mods to be the ideal stand. Got her out of bed at past midnight and managed to get her approval on the surgery to be carried out on her cabinet tomorrow morning (I have a very understanding wife). Only just one thing... I've been reading stacks over the last few months and know that the larger the tank is the more stable and forgiving it's environment will be. This being the reason why everyone says to start off with the largest tank possible. The cabinet will accommodate a 35*14*18 tank which is just 40g... I would like some advice from the more experienced reefers, is a tank this small a bad idea and will it be much to difficult to keep healthy for me or is it just going to require a bit more attention than a larger tank? What would my chances of success be?

Thanks for your advice

 

[igoRluse]

Also, what kind of bioload could a 40g tank handle? Once I've got the hand for this and all the necessary equipment, I was hoping to put

_2 perculas with a host anenome
_a yellow tang
_1 or 2 other fish I haven't decided on yet
_A clam
_The cleaning crew (snails, hermits, shrimps)
_The appropriate selection of corals

Does this seem optimistic?

 

[Entacmaea]

WELCOME!

Sounds like your wife is VERY understanding :wink:

My first question would be about the cabinet, and if it would hold the 250+ lbs of saltwater plus another 150 lbs of rock and sand...

As for the water volume (about 30 gallons after displacement I guess), you of course can get it to work. It sounds like you have been doing reading which is great, so I would say go for it! Of course the larger the tank the better, and more stable as you said, but that size is of course manageable.

Are you getting the 200 gallon eventually? If you are, I would scrap the 40 gallon idea all together and save your money for the "big" one You WILL want a larger tank, and if you have been dreaming about the 200 gallon, the 40 will be great to get your feet wet, but not satisfying in the same way. Alot of the equipment you will not be able to transfer over to the 200 due to differences in scale...

 

[Entacmaea]

The tang police would I think question having a tang in a tank that size...

Also, anemones can be difficult to keep, and you might want to gain some experience first. "Host Anemone Secrets" is a cheap, short book that is a must if you want to keep anemones. It will give you a good idea about what you are getting into. There are a bunch of surrogate hosts for clowns that are much easier to keep alive in a first tank. Also it is always best to research what kinds of corals you want to keep first, then work backwards from there as to equipment. If you want a clam, you will need intense lighting, and that will also influence what corals you are able to keep...

 

[AngelMaster]

My first marine tank was and still is a 35 gallon hex. I'ts been pretty easy so far, I honestly don't see how everyone says its harder compared to fresh water, I've had freshwater tanks for about 10 years. Besides a little bit more maitenance, I find it as easy as a freshwater set-up. Maybe I've just been really lucky but I don't think your tank is too small for a first timer. I've also taken care to only try to have species tolerant to first timers and would suggest you do the same. You'll save money in the long run.

Your bio-load tolerance will vary greatly on how many corals you intend to have and what kind of corals they are. With such limited tank space, I find my fish do interact more with my corals than they would in a larger tank. Occasionally nibbling, etc. I'd decide which is more important to you Fish or corals and stick with one or the other. In such a small tank even species that are known for not bothering corals, will do so occasionally. I have mostly fish in mine, only a leather and a bubble coal. Currently I have a dwarf angel, 2 damsels, a boxer shirmp and a watchman goby.

Your tang is too big for a tank that size, also your clam probably won't live, they're VERY sensitive to water conditions which will fluctuate in a small setup no matter how diligent you are with your parameters.

 

[Robin Goodfellow]

Got her out of bed at past midnight and managed to get her approval ...

hi.
if I get my wife out of the bed after midnight, I would get a punch on my left eye right away, not even considering to get her approval of any kind...

40 gal is a good start, but you just have to refrain yourself from overstocking the tank, even if your wife don't stop/question you.

 

[Len]

WELCOME TO REEFS.ORG!

A 40 gallon is a good dimension, but as you guessed it, the more water volume the easier it is. A 40 shouldn't be too hard for a newbie, but like others said, stock lightly.

Here's something nearly every reefkeeper will tell you from experience: Get the biggest tank you can to start with It doesn't have just to do with how much easier a bigger tank is to keep stable, but eventually you'll want one. It's less of a headache and financial drain (in the long run) if you start big. I went from a 10 gallon to a 26 gallon to a 50 gallon and now to my 120 gallon. No doubt, i'll want to go bigger yet again when I have the room for it.

We're here to help set up any size tank you decide on.

 

[Osama]

Three years ago when I was shopping for my first tank, I started with 60g & ended up buying a 180g. Now I could use a 300g. I would go for the largest you can afford.

 

[fishfarmer]

I started with a 38 gal + sump. It think it is a great size for beginners, you can do decent water changes with one bucket :wink: . You are limited with fish selection and can be limited with the size of corals. Most of the LFS in my area carry big coral colonies that wouldn't fit easily in a small tank.

 

[Anonymous]

Ok!...... first of all...you are a very lucky man to have a wife that you can share this hobby with. Could we share? My first salt was a ten my second was 29...........as long as you use good filtration( I like to use a reduntant system) you will have no more difficulty than keeping Freshies. Trust me on this.

 

[igoRluse]

Thanks guys for all your answers. As you all seem to be helpful, I'm going to hit you with a few more questions.

The setup I had in mind is a 40g tank (36*14*18) with 1 (2 maybe?) internal overflow and a hang on type refugium. A few fish, invertebrates and a few corals for color but with a good bioload buffer to make sure I have a stable system. Underneath I'll have a sump with a hang on type venturi skimmer and the circulation pump. In the tank I will have 30 kg live rock and live sand. As for the lighting, I was thinking of going with VHO. What wattage and color should I look for?What do you think of this setup and how would you experienced guys do it?

I went to the LFS this morning to check out the prices and saw basically 2 categories of skimmers, the normal stand up ones for $300 ot $400 and some others that are hang on venturi type with the pump for about $100. What do you think of these?

I am lucky enough to line on the coast and have a beautiful coral reef just on my doorstep. I like the idea of giving the animals natural water. What are your considerations on this? And should I just go and choose my own live rock and sand? I am a keen scuba diver so it wouldn't be an issue.

Thanks again

 

[igoRluse]

Thanks guys for all your answers. As you all seem to be helpful, I'm going to hit you with a few more questions.

The setup I had in mind is a 40g tank (36*14*18) with 1 (2 maybe?) internal overflow and a hang on type refugium. A few fish, invertebrates and a few corals for color but with a good bioload buffer to make sure I have a stable system. Underneath I'll have a sump with a hang on type venturi skimmer and the circulation pump. In the tank I will have 30 kg live rock and live sand. As for the lighting, I was thinking of going with VHO. What wattage and color should I look for?What do you think of this setup and how would you experienced guys do it?

I went to the LFS this morning to check out the prices and saw basically 2 categories of skimmers, the normal stand up ones for $300 ot $400 and some others that are hang on venturi type with the pump for about $100. What do you think of these?

I am lucky enough to line on the coast and have a beautiful coral reef just on my doorstep. I like the idea of giving the animals natural water. What are your considerations on this? And should I just go and choose my own live rock and sand? I am a keen scuba diver so it wouldn't be an issue.

Thanks again

 

[Anonymous]

Where exactly do you live? Using rock, sand, and water collected from a reef is an excellent idea, assuming it's legal where you are. The rock should have certain things removed that will die in your tank to prevent pollution. You'll want the tank to cycle before you add any fish, of course. Natural salt water, is in my opinion, infinitely better for corals than artificial salt water. I am fortunate enough to have access to clean natural salt water from a coldwater coast and my corals thrive in it. It isn't filtered or sterilized, just warmed up to tank temperature.

 

[igoRluse]

<quote>Hi, my name is Matt, and I'm a former marsupial. </quote>

Well that means you're probably not so far from me. I live in Perth western australia and I have access to some beautiful (unpoluted as far as I know) sand, reefs all around Rottnest island. I don't know the legal stuff here but I don't think getting my live sand would bother anyone. For the live rock... I'm not too sure. Guess I'll have to do a bit of research.

What would the procedure be before putting all this in my tank?

 

[Anonymous]

Hey we have a marsupial in N America too, the oppossum! I don't have any connection to AUS, unfortunately. My friends used to call me wombat as a corruption of my last name...long story....

If it's from a good looking reef, the water must be OK. The procedure I would follow is to:
1) Select around 40 lbs or so (approx. a 5 gallon / 20 liter bucket) of wet sand from the top layer, maybe more if you prefer a deep sand bed.
2) Select some small pieces of live rock, preferably without any large sponges or corals that will die and pollute your tank.
3)Fill er up with water from the reef, and turn everything on!

You sound like you have a good grasp of the equipment and such you'll need to be using. I would buy the best skimmer you can afford, probably an in sump or external and not a hang-on. One downside of selecting your own rock is that you may have a lot of undesirable hitchhikers like mantis shrimps or predatory crabs. There are methods of "curing" your live rock to rid them of these nasties, and you may want to consider doing this. Personally, I would leave the skimmer on and the lights off for the first two months before adding any fish or corals. Your tank will still go through a typical cycle where animals and plants on your rock die off and are consumed by bacteria. The best piece of advice I can offer is to ask lots of questions here and buy and read some good reefkeeping books before starting....

 

[squeezix]

I have a 38. It hyas a 15 gallon sump and 3 gallon refugium with 24/7 lighting.
I opted for 96W PC Actinic with 175 MH 10,000K.
I have several soft and hard corals, have lost 3 out of 7 fish, and a small clam that may have been unhealthy to begin with.
The fish were small and probably attacked by another animal. I have at least 100 Lbs of live rock. The sump and refuge are full of it.
My soft corals grow slowly, the ones in caves do better. My LPS and SPS do very well. My SPS have grown 1000% in the past year, LPS 10%.
Corralimorphs 10%, leather is hanging by a string and anthelia surviving but not growing much.
I try to change 5 gallons a week, but sometimes hesitate because major growth seems to happen when I don't change.
I use B-Ionic every night.
I would much rather have 200 gallons of water in a 90 or 125 show tank, but my reef is doing very well with dilligence.
I have lost a few animals, but it seems that my aquacultured animals have done much better than wild-caught, tempting as wild caught may be.
50 gallons is easy to maintain, but it takes a lot of diligence to keep the water quality stable.
Go for the biggest system you can afford. Going natural (skimmer, 1.5-2 lbs LR per gallon, turf scrubber/refugium) and using chemicals via top off) would be a cheap way to go. You can always add chillers, Kalk reactors, power filters later. Watch your back and drill a few (4)bulkhead size holes in your sump. You may need them later. Much easier to do it now than it will be in a year.