help me understand canister filters

[rowan]

hi again

i just bought two magnum 350 canister filters, both with biowheels, to replace my filters that just died. i have no experience with these. (FO tank)

i have never had canister filters before, and theres something i cant seem to grasp. if i need to change out the filter media on a monthly basis, does my tank have to re-cycle every time?

i have two, should i change the filter media both at once? wait two weeks inbetween?

i dont get it.

gael
)o(

 

[Anonymous]

Your tank will not cycle everytime you change the media. If your cannisters include media to encourage the growth of beneficial microbes, that media should be disturbed as little as possible when you change the carbon or whatever else you have in there. That includes the bio-wheels.

Wouldn't hurt to stagger changing the media in the two filters as you are thinking.

Do you have live rock in the tank or a live sand bed ? Even for a FO, this is the preferred way to grow the beneficial microbes these days.

 

[rowan]

Your tank will not cycle everytime you change the media. If your cannisters include media to encourage the growth of beneficial microbes, that media should be disturbed as little as possible when you change the carbon or whatever else you have in there. That includes the bio-wheels.

Wouldn't hurt to stagger changing the media in the two filters as you are thinking.

Do you have live rock in the tank or a live sand bed ? Even for a FO, this is the preferred way to grow the beneficial microbes these days.

...hi, thanks for the reply.

my tank had LS, until recently...the rock may be live, its been in there for 3 years. there are some small creatures on it, but i wouldnt say its teeming with life. i will be adding a few scoops of sand from my reef tank to this tank in the next few days.

gael

 

[danmhippo]

How much rock you have in the tank, and how big is the tank?

How much nitrogen processing capacity your tank has relates to how much surface area it there is. So if the surface area of the available tank wall and sand surface is constant, the only variable is the rock. The premium rock is very porous thus allowing as much surface area possible per cubic feet.

Most reef tanks does not even need canister filters because these type of tanks has LOTS of rocks (eg. 40G tank has 40lb of rocks, 100G tank has 80lb of rocks....etc). Sufficient surface area on the LR for bacteria to colonize eleminates the need for canister filter to provide biological filtration.

If you haven't yet, I would suggest you look into this BB's articles in the library collection: http://www.reefs.org/library .

 

[AllenF]

Correct.

I use my cannister to run carbon, chemi-pure, and crushed coral.

Live rock and live sand takes care of the rest.

You still want to be meticulous about the upkeep though. Keeping debris off the screen inside helps cut down on nitrate production.

 

[beerbaron]

Just a note FYI biowheels should not be replaced with your regular media changes if at all. which you may already know, but i just want to make sure.
HTH
BB

 

[Anonymous]

Spot on, baron.

 

[rowan]

Just a note FYI biowheels should not be replaced with your regular media changes if at all. which you may already know, but i just want to make sure.
HTH
BB

no, i didnt know, so thanks for telling me. i think the instructions said to rinse them off monthly and replace. i thought that if (when) i rinse them, it should be in (perhaps) the water i've removed from the tank during a water change. yes? no? the instructions didnt say...

gael

 

[danmhippo]

The "biowheel" is where the bacteria colonizes on. The instruction meant to tell you to rinse off detritus accumulates on it from time to time, but don't replace it. Besides, if your tank has enough rock per gallon ratio, you really don't need the biowheel attachment anyway.

 

[rowan]

How much rock you have in the tank, and how big is the tank?

How much nitrogen processing capacity your tank has relates to how much surface area it there is. So if the surface area of the available tank wall and sand surface is constant, the only variable is the rock. The premium rock is very porous thus allowing as much surface area possible per cubic feet.

Most reef tanks does not even need canister filters because these type of tanks has LOTS of rocks (eg. 40G tank has 40lb of rocks, 100G tank has 80lb of rocks....etc). Sufficient surface area on the LR for bacteria to colonize eleminates the need for canister filter to provide biological filtration.

If you haven't yet, I would suggest you look into this BB's articles in the library collection: http://www.reefs.org/library .

thank you for the link. my tank is 150gallons, prolly 80lbs of rock, perhaps more. its very porous stuff. the gravel is crushed coral, 150lbs. i am re-starting my fo tank which i somehow managed to almost kill off last week. i'd consider adding LR from my 'reef' tank, but i've currently got an aiptasia prob in there and would hate to spread it.

my reef (100g..which is in reality LR and a couple fish and inverts) is doing great.

but i had replaced the filters (fo tank) on friday with two magnum 350's and its my first time using canisters, so i have to admit i'm befuddled.

gael

 

[rowan]

You still want to be meticulous about the upkeep though. Keeping debris off the screen inside helps cut down on nitrate production.

by this you're talking about inside the canister? the part that holds the carbon in it? its like a plastic sleeve, filled with carbon, covered in a fiberous sleeve, mounted inside the canister.

the directions said to pull it all out, rinse the sleeve, replace the carbon, and replace the fiber on a monthly basis. but if i replace and/or rinse it all, it seems to me i lose all my bacteria and i'd re-cycle.

i deffy must do more reading.

thanks
gael

 

[rowan]

The "biowheel" is where the bacteria colonizes on. The instruction meant to tell you to rinse off detritus accumulates on it from time to time, but don't replace it. Besides, if your tank has enough rock per gallon ratio, you really don't need the biowheel attachment anyway.

OOOOHHH, alright. (slaping my forhead with a 'doh!)

i gotcha now.

i suppose i should be at a FO site asking these questions. what is a good FO site? i only come here because of my other tank being a reef. (of sorts)

gael

 

[Marcosreef]

i suppose i should be at a FO site asking these questions. what is a good FO site? i only come here because of my other tank being a reef. (of sorts)

gael

If you want to learn, your're at the right place... welcome!

Marco

 

[danmhippo]

Heh, this is it. Actually, most marine tanks works the same, and with technology and methods improves, many shares same equipments and features regardless if they are FO tank, FOWLR, or Reef. Many of us not only has Reef, but also has multiple other tanks, FO, FW...etc.

If you have other Qs', just shoot, and whoever see it will do their best to find the answer for it.

 

[reefsRcool]

i used to use a magnum 350 for carbon my biggest piece of advice is to not use the sleeve that they give you for around the container, just put carbon in it and go.

As far as the bio wheels goes I woudn't use them i would get more rock. If you do use them don't rinse away to much, the crud that grows in there is good. maybe you should take some of the rock from your reef and reseed the rock in your FO. you definatly should think about moving int he direction of FOWLR. magnum 350's arn't exactly given away at most stores cheapest i have seen them locally is $150 i'm curiose why you didn't just buy rock instead.

do you use any kind of skimmer?

and you are int he right place to ask questions, most people arn't reef tank snobs.

 

[JB_In_Fla]

I use a magnum 350 on my FW 72g tank and I did have problems RE-cycling after I cleaned the filter. Something I used to do no problem on my smaller tanks but on this I have resorted to ONLY cleaning the foam but not the media chamber. I'll just leave it there until the thing rots away since cleaning/replacing it caused two minor cycles on my tank. Nothing died but I wasn't very happy. Otherwise nice, quite and does the job well for my moderately stocked and sometimes grosely overfed FW tank

 

[LittleFish1]

I'm using a Eheim canister. What I do every month is change the carbon & those white/fine filter pad. I only rinse my bio-media (in yr case, the bio wheel) lightly with tank water. DO NOT rinse it with tap/fresh water. Fresh water will kill off all the bacteria u trying to grow inside. I do the rinsing real fast to avoid exposing bio-media in the air.

Was told that canister is a Nitrate factory. Had a NO3 boom in Jan & still trying to bring it down. Suggest u remove the bio-media out once yr sandbed has established enough bio-bacteria (maybe after running it for 1 month). U can try removing the bio-media from the first canister & monitor the Ammonia & NO2 level closely. Then remove from the 2nd canister 1 month later. This should help u to stablise the param.

Good luck.

 

[rowan]

i used to use a magnum 350 for carbon my biggest piece of advice is to not use the sleeve that they give you for around the container, just put carbon in it and go.

As far as the bio wheels goes I woudn't use them i would get more rock. If you do use them don't rinse away to much, the crud that grows in there is good. maybe you should take some of the rock from your reef and reseed the rock in your FO. you definatly should think about moving int he direction of FOWLR. magnum 350's arn't exactly given away at most stores cheapest i have seen them locally is $150 i'm curiose why you didn't just buy rock instead.

do you use any kind of skimmer?

and you are int he right place to ask questions, most people arn't reef tank snobs.

well. i had a wet/dry system in my Fo tank but it died (last year) and i replaced it with two skilters at the time because of money constraints. they worked for a time, and i got comfortable with them and kinda forgot that i'd meant them to be temporary. last month i began to have problems with my water...all my levels were good, but the water was smoky. i had just gotten my tax return and i knew i needed to seriously filter that tank, so i bought the mag 350's at what used to be petwarehouse, now dr's something or other. they were only 99bux each, so i went for it.

i do have a skimmer, but for the life of me i can not get it to work right. believe me i tried every way imaginable. maybe the water was just too far gone. i had removed one of the skilters and put the skimmer in its place at one point, but things got worse, and even tho i put the skilter back on almost everyone died last week.

it never occured to me to buy LR instead. my plan has been to re-seed the sand with sand from my reef. or to re-seed with store bought live sand.

what i need to do is spend much more time here reading up on the lastest, because its obvious i'm WAY behind the times on tank management.

the problem is, everyone has so many opposing views, i never know which is right. you know?

gael

 

[rowan]

Heh, this is it. Actually, most marine tanks works the same, and with technology and methods improves, many shares same equipments and features regardless if they are FO tank, FOWLR, or Reef. Many of us not only has Reef, but also has multiple other tanks, FO, FW...etc.

If you have other Qs', just shoot, and whoever see it will do their best to find the answer for it.

cool. thanks. when i used to come here before, long ago, people werent so nice when someone asked a seemingly stupid question. once i even followed someones advice about glueing an anemone (YES! AN ANEMONE) to a rock! only to find out later that this person was famous for doing that to people.....i knew it was wrong, but i took this guys word for it as he told someone else how it was done.

anyway, i'm really glad things have changed here

gael

 

[rowan]

I'm using a Eheim canister. What I do every month is change the carbon & those white/fine filter pad. I only rinse my bio-media (in yr case, the bio wheel) lightly with tank water. DO NOT rinse it with tap/fresh water. Fresh water will kill off all the bacteria u trying to grow inside. I do the rinsing real fast to avoid exposing bio-media in the air.

Was told that canister is a Nitrate factory. Had a NO3 boom in Jan & still trying to bring it down. Suggest u remove the bio-media out once yr sandbed has established enough bio-bacteria (maybe after running it for 1 month). U can try removing the bio-media from the first canister & monitor the Ammonia & NO2 level closely. Then remove from the 2nd canister 1 month later. This should help u to stablise the param.

Good luck.

ay yi yi

i spend SO much money making the wrong decisions.

do i just let the filter run then, once i remove the biowheels? and keep in the carbon? the filter pad? or shut the whole thing off?

gael