Just installed my Durso standpipe but now...

[Larry Grenier]

I'm setting-up a 75 oceanic with a corner overflow. I hooked-up my SEN 700 or maybe 750 and the amount of noise was outrageous. I built and installed a Durso standpipe and the flushing noise up-top is gone but the noise where the water enters the sump is still annoying. Sounds like a pot of boiling water. The return-line enters below the surfase in the sump. Anything I can do about it?

 

[ReefLion]

If you understand the principles of the Durso, build a reverse one for the sump. Connect the drain output to a large container with a large outlet hole near the bottom (well below the water line) and a couple small airholes at the top (above the water line). I've used gallon milk jugs and sections of wide-diameter PVC.

There are a lot of effective designs you could use. The key is allowing a large space for water to fall into, which is mainly soundproof but vented with one or more smallish holes. The return bubbles should rise *within the large container*. Let me know if that's unclear.

Tim

 

[DBW]

You need to allow the water and air mixture to enter the sump so that it doesn't bubble as much. Easiest way to do that is have the water/air exit the piping at the water surface in the sump. You could also run it out onto a flat surface that is right at the water surface as well.

 

[reefland]

If you can have the drains at an angle vs. directly downwards it really helps as well. But I would suggest using the suggestions above as well. I have my pipes drain into a 4 inch vertical PVC pipe as described above. That goes just slightly above the water surface. It was mainly for air bubble baffle but did help to quiet it down. It may take a few tricks but you can get the tank silent. My 180 tank, 55 gallon sump and skimmer are silent. You only hear the cooling fans and fans on the water pumps.

 

[Reefguide]

Is there a diagram or something I can look at? I too could benefit from that, both as a bubble baffle and a silencer. Any drawings, sketches, links would be greatly appriciated ! Thanks...

 

[reefland]

Sorry I don't have anything. Measure the distance from the bottom of the sump to the level of the water surface and cut a large diameter section of PVC pipe to that plus a little bit more.

 

[Reefguide]

And drill holes in the botton portion to alow flow into the sump while bubbles rise? How does that help with noise?

 

[reefland]

And drill holes in the botton portion to alow flow into the sump while bubbles rise? How does that help with noise?

I don't have holes drilled in mine. No clue on the science behind this. Most of this is trial and error. If you drilled holes in the bottom of it, my guess is air bubbles will go out the holes as well if you have decent water flow coming out of these pipes.

 

[ReefLion]

I don't have a diagram but here's what's happening. You have a mixture of water and air coming into the sump. It's noisy when it comes in, so what's the answer? Put a "dome" over the area where it enters the sump.

The problem with a plain "dome" is that the air ends up filling it up, and then bubbling around the sides so that it can escape. That's just more noise. The answer to *that* is to make airholes in the top of the dome so that air can escape through the top, while water just exits at the bottom. This allows all your bubbling and noise to occur within the dome. The holes are small enough that noice doesn't really escape. That's what happens with the small holes at the top of your Durso standpipe, except that air is being sucked in rather than pushed out.

Hope that helps.

Tim

 

[Larry Grenier]

I already had the water entering the sump and then going through 2 45 degree bends and shooting across the sump. I cut a 45 degree andle at the end of the output (short on top and long on bottom) and lowered the water level so only 2/3s of the pipe in under water and it's fine now. Thanks to Richard Durso for the other end!

 

[reefland]

nice drawing!

 

[Marrowbone]

Larry,

Thanks for the diagram... very interesting.

I am in the middle of redoing my sump setup on my 75rr, which currently is a prefab acrylic sump, half of which used to be a wetdry chamber. This is going to be replaced entirely with probably a 30 gal AGA, most likely undrilled. I will fill this with a DSB and macroalgae and light it so it can be a good refugium, and ditch my skimmer altogether... i think i want to keep what would be skimmate as mud in the fuge.

Anyway my thoughts on your design are that you are taking advantage of the kinetic energy of the falling water from your main tank, by diverting it into a gentle horizontal motion, not unlike a powerhead. The other designs mentioned on this page stifle the sound of the water entering the sump, but also the energy (granted the violence of the water splashing in a muffling chamber would probably aerate the water immensely).

It looks to me as though you are getting some real nice gentle water motion perfect for a refugium without adding a powerhead down there... which would use more electricty and chew up more of the micro-life in the water column.

It seems like so many people are concerned with maximizing the output of their pumps by minimizing the head on their plumbing and such, but are they overlooking the kinetic energy of the water overflowing INTO their sumps?

The typical use of the sump, mainly as a place to serve the skimmer and heater and other equipment, may not benefit as much from this type of setup, although i think that it still may not be good to have any place that would collect detritus in the sump if it was not an area with a DSB.

What do you think?

 

[Larry Grenier]

Hey Marrowbone; I'm not too worried about detritus collecting in what I'm calling the Sumpfugium. I'm hoping to create a large pod haven down there. If I see it's a problem in the future I'll make adjustments but there seems to be plenty of circulation. Yes, I wanted to minimize the amount of loss by not constricting the output and this gentle angle (2 45s instead of 1 90 angle) with no other restrictions seems to do the trick.

Richard, I was amazed at how noisy the overflow was and what a big impact your gadget made. I'll add a link to your page when I make my next update.

Folks, I'm obviously bucking the trend of complex sumps and refugiums with compartments and baffles and such but it seems to work for me. Since the water enters the sump at one end of the 3 foot container at the surface and the skimmer is also at that end and the return pump is at the other end at the bottom, I don't seem to be having a problem with bubbles being pumped into the main tank.

 

[agiacosa]

Please see my post on how I silenced my sump.

Regards,

Art Giacosa

 

[Marrowbone]

Larry, I should have said with my last sentance that it probably isnt good to have detritus settling on the bare "glass" at the bottom of the sump, (the way it had been in my setup in the past).

I think your sump, being one big refugium, is the PERFECT place for the junk to settle, (because of the natural substrate, rubble, macroalgae and pods), and while the circulation thru this area should be gentle, it should be fairly substantial... the way i think you've got it.

My plan is to modify my system to be very similar to your setup, except that im going to put the DSB in the Griener Sumpfugium and leave off the skimmer for a while.

Thanks for the inspiration in design... i wasnt too sure what i was going to do with my sump before ...rofl, or should i put the wet/dry back in to feed nitrates to the macroalgae?! nm

Art, nice work, we always need different plumbing ideas to peruse!

 

[Larry Grenier]

Hey Marrowbone thanks for the kudos bt my name is spelled G-r-e-n-i-e-r. It's French, a common name in Canada where my Grandfather is from. Anyway, it's very simple and works fine if you have a long tank (30" or more)
sumpfugium 8)

 

[Marrowbone]

Doh! Sorry 'bout that. I'm used to people misspelling my name, but that doesnt make it any less irksome! Trying to type fast at work is no excuse... I also misspelled project/client name in work correspondence today.

 

[Larry Grenier]

Progressive violin... very kewl 8)

 

[Marrowbone]

Thanks man... yeah we play Prague rock :lol:
...as far south as Baltimore... so far.

 

[bayondai]

I know this is an older post, but I have the same problems. I was just reading what Reefland suggested, but he didn't have a diagram. I made a diagram from what I think he said and is posted below. Is this what you mean?