Yellow Tang Vs. Sailfin: How much bullying is too much?

[Reefguide]

When I set up my 29g reef about 2 years ago, I knew nothing about what ppl say about tank sizes for tangs, ect. I had a Yellow tang, a blue hippo tang, and a true perc. NEVER, NEVER did they fight, chase eachother, show signs of stress, ect. They grew quite rapidly reaching both about 3 1/2". And fat like you couldn't believe. I removed them only because they were munching on my xenias, and knew that they were getting too big already. I do plan on maybe getting another yellow maybe about 2" if I can find one.

When the "Tang Police" (I love that by the way...) starts a rant, what exactly are the issues ? Tangs sicken in small tanks and die? Or you just feel bad for the little guys having limited swimming room?

I always hear : "No, thats too small, for Tags" but I rearly hear why... Maybe I'm just ignorant... Enlighten me...

 

[Anonymous]

Watch the "my tang has ich" threads that are as common as fleas on a stray dog, and check out the stocking levels practiced by those with sick fish. You will rarely see one of these threads where stocking levels arent't an issue, while by the same token you rarely (if ever) see someone with a reasonably stocked large tank posting with disease problems. I believe this is more than coincidence.

Additionally, my view is that we should attempt to provide the optimum environment for our fish, not the minimum that we can get away with. I have seen tangs in 55 gallon tanks, and I have seen the same tangs relocated to several thousand gallon propogation tanks. The difference in the vitality, color, and activity levels of these fish is stunning. I would like to strive to provide a setting where my fish behave somewhat as they do in nature. If all they can do is float in a 29 gallon tank and not even swim the length of their body, I have failed them.

The fact that fish don't fight isn't a measure of success, imo.

Brian

 

[SPC]

Posted by Reeferguide:

When the "Tang Police" (I love that by the way...) starts a rant, what exactly are the issues ? Tangs sicken in small tanks and die?

-Yes

Or you just feel bad for the little guys having limited swimming room?

-Yes

I always hear : "No, thats too small, for Tags" but I rearly hear why... Maybe I'm just ignorant... Enlighten me...

I don't know about "Tags" but those are my answers to your questions about tangs. :wink:
Steve

 

[Reefguide]

I don't want to start an argument, but IMO, if your going to frown on ppl for having tangs in 29's, 55's, ect, we need to frown on the whole aquarium hobbie as a whole.

All Corals, fish, inverts, ect are more likely to sicken in aquariums as they are in the wind aren't they? Tank crashes, improper feeding, poor maintnance all contribute. So why not just take a stand against the aquarium trade?

You speak of Ideal tanks for tangs, honestly.... I personally think no aquarium being a 5g or 3000g is a substiute for the worlds oceas for any marine animal. Whether it's a clown or a tang, your still taking an animal out of it's enviorment and into a glass box.

Tangs might be more comfortable in a larger aquariums but then again, how can you prove to me that clowns, arent more confy too in larger aquariums... I've never heard of someone objecting to a clown in say a 10g...

I love my Aquarium, fish, corals, ect. If I had a major tank crash I think I'd probably jump off the nearest 20 story building. Frankly If I like a yellow tang and I have a 29g, I'm going to try it. Obviously If he sickens, I will return him to the LFS. I'm not going to let him die. That would be plain and simple stupidity.

I see you guys saying that tangs are basucally happier in larger aquariums, I think any animal would be... dont you?

I know I'm going to take seriuos heat for this. LET THE GAMES BEGIN !

 

[Reefguide]

Or you just feel bad for the little guys having limited swimming room?

-Yes

I'm glad you said that.... Don't you feel badly for the rest of your fish stuck in a glass box regradless of the size?

Do you understand the point I'm trying to make?

 

[Anonymous]

Do you understand the point I'm trying to make?

No, I can only see someone justifying in their own mind a stocking decision.

I've never heard of someone objecting to a clown in say a 10g...

I have. Many times when someone wants to keep a larger clown fish in a nano or other small tank. In any case, comparing a clownfish to a tang is comparing apples to oranges. A clownfish is very territorial, and doesn't wander very far from its home. I have a 550 gallon tank and in all the time my percula clownfish have been in there, they haven't moved more than a foot from their spot in the tank. My hepatus tang, on the other hand, swims over every square inch of the tank.

IMO, if your going to frown on ppl for having tangs in 29's, 55's, ect, we need to frown on the whole aquarium hobbie as a whole.

Sorry, you will need to explain the logic of that statement. I am opposed to people keeping great danes in 4x4 kennels, but that doesn't mean I am opposed to dog ownership. The argument that "no tank is as big as the ocean, so it doesn't make a difference about tank size" is SO tired.

Frankly If I like a yellow tang and I have a 29g, I'm going to try it.

Of course you will, because it is all about what YOU want.

That would be plain and simple stupidity

Couldn't agree more.

Brian

 

[Minh Nguyen]

.........
I love my Aquarium, fish, corals, ect. If I had a major tank crash I think I'd probably jump off the nearest 20 story building.

Please don't do this because I don't think you will live very long.

Frankly If I like a yellow tang and I have a 29g, I'm going to try it. Obviously If he sickens, I will return him to the LFS. I'm not going to let him die. That would be plain and simple stupidity.

..........

It is indeed a sad day when LFS can keep fish better than reefers.
I think we should be able to take sick fish from LFS and cure them, not the other way around.

Minh

 

[SPC]

Posted by Reefguide:

Frankly If I like a yellow tang and I have a 29g, I'm going to try it. Obviously If he sickens, I will return him to the LFS. I'm not going to let him die. That would be plain and simple stupidity.

-Huh? :?
Steve

 

[naesco]

Many tangs (not Clown, Powder Bue and Goldrim which are impossible to extremely difficult even for expert reefers) are fairly easy to keep given good water conditions and a large tank.

Why a large tank
1. There is less aggression between tangs and other fish and between tang species.
2. Tangs are swimmers by nature. That is what they do. Other fish kind of putter around amongst our rockwork. Tangs need the swimming room large (long) tanks provide. Anyone who observes these fish in small and large tanks know what I am referring to.
3. Ich which seem to affect tangs quickly, is less likely given the above 2.

WHO ARE the tang police and why are they telling us what to do?
The tang police are a bunch of reefers who keep tangs and have the experience to know their requirements. That is why this group of reefers are labeled the tang police. They have already experienced the loss of this fish because they cannot be kept successfully (clown tangs);
they cannot be kept together (purple and yellow), or
they cannot be kept healthy and happy long term (in small tanks)
Reefers do not need to go through the tang fish death and tank fish death that putting a powder blue tang in your tank almost guarantees.
Yes, there are some reefers who have had success and they are the first to post their success and will disagree with what I have posted but they are clearly in a very very lucky class of reefers.

I hope this explains the necessity for larger tanks and the reason why so many reefers post on this issue. They do not want you to learn the hard way like they did.
Is not this one of the main purposes of this board?
Thank you

 

[esmithiii]

ReefGuide- I hope you are not "guiding" anyone with advice about putting a tang in a 29g. That is not intended as a flame, but I think the advice is irresponsible.

Tangs need room to roam; they cover a lot of area Other fish will not stray more than a few feet from one spot during their entire lives!!

Tangs need the room to excercise, and to be healthy. I have seen tons of sick tangs in 55g tanks and smaller.

Anyway, as far as the suggestion to buy the 500 fishes book. I own it... I've had it for a very long time.

Maybe you should read it then. What is the minimum tank size that Scott Michael states is necessary for Zebrasoma flavescens?

In my 180G, I have a yellow and a sailfin. There was some issues the first week, but after the first week the aggression stopped. The yellow is much bigger, but the sailfin has grown quite a bit in the last 2 months.

Ernie

 

[Reefguide]

Ernie -

First of all, I'm not the one that posted that I have the book.

Secondly, I am not "guiding" anyone to do anything nor have I ever...

Your 180 is I'd say 6' long? So your telling me that Tangs dont travel more than about 6' along the reef ?? I'm just going to drop this topic, no sense in arguing.

 

[Minh Nguyen]

........
I know I'm going to take seriuos heat for this. LET THE GAMES BEGIN !

........I'm just going to drop this topic, no sense in arguing.

Give up already?
Maybe you should not fire the first shot.

Minh

 

[reefsRcool]

not to interupt a perfectly good argument, but tangs and small tanks do not mix. that is life deal with it. if you want a tang get enough tank if you want a small tank don't get a tang. why do some people act so stuborn, look at it this way. can you live in a one room studio apartments. sure you can, and you might not die. but do you want to? wouldn't you rather have a nice place to wander around in as you ponder your meaningless existence.

 

[esmithiii]

Ernie -

First of all, I'm not the one that posted that I have the book.

Secondly, I am not "guiding" anyone to do anything nor have I ever...

The quote was not directed at you but at rwillden, Sorry, I should have been more clear as to who I was addressing myself to. As for the "guiding" part, that is your handle, right? ReefGuide? Right?

As for my 6' tank, my tang has room to swim quite fast from one end of the tank to the other, make an arc (the tank is 2' wide, no 1' like a 55) and return behind or under the rock work. He can exercise much more than in a 55g.

Ernie

 

[Reefguide]

Well as for the name ReefGuide, I've answered that question before, when asked about my handle. I do Web Design/Development and that was a domain name that I was working on for a customer, and I was left holding the bag and his deposit. By the way, It's for sale if you want it.

Yeah I can live in a studio apartment, and from my experience a tang can live in a 29g.

 

[SPC]

Posted by Reefguide:

Yeah I can live in a studio apartment,

-No one asked if you could, they asked if you would want to.
Steve

 

[Anonymous]

Reefguide, I could quote dozens of noted marine fish experts who would cringe at the thought of keeping tangs in a 29 gallon tank. Can you name one who would agree with you?

Don't you see how selfish your attitude is? You are so concerned with having it YOUR way, that you don't see how the fish you keep suffer.

How sad, how sad, and a textbook example why sometimes I think this hobby should be regulated.

Brian

 

[Reefguide]

Do you think any anyone would want to live in a studio apartment or a luxery 7000sq foot home?

Do you think any animal would like to live in a 29g or an open ocean?

 

[Reefguide]

Brian, first of all read the post corerctly. I no longer hang tangs in my 29g. I got rid of them because they were eating my Xenias. But they were happy and healthy.

I'm selfish?? Aren't we all??? We are taking marine animals out of the wild and putting them in glass cages for our amusement? Yes I do it because I like teh hobby very much. If your going to call me Selfish, take a really long hard look at yourself and every other member (inclusing myself) of this hobby. Or do you buy onyl tank raised corals and fish? Dind't think so !

 

[Anonymous]

Reefguide, I have no problem looking at myself. I keep my tang in a 8'x3'x3' tank. Not perfect, but quite a bit of swimming room.

Like I said before, keep trying to convince yourself you are right. That will make one person who agrees with your asinine reasoning.

Brian