Planting mangroves?
- Thread starter DKKA
- Start date
- Location
- Virginia
Don't forget to acclimate them. Most of them are not grown in salt water and no one ever tells you this. You need to acclimate them over a few weeks or they will probably die. I got 10 from florida plants online, and only 2 have leaves left. They said they were ready to go in right away, but neglected to talk about how they were raised in fresh water and salt shock would probably kill them.
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by davelin315:
<STRONG> I got 10 from florida plants online, and only 2 have leaves left.</STRONG><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Dave, There is a very good chance your plants are fine. To rid themselves of excess salt when suddenly exposed to salt water, mangroves will intentionally drop their leaves to speed the process. I received 10 also from floridaplants and dropped them right in. Almost all lost all their leaves with a small exception, but now, a year later all 10 are growing fine. Some over 3' tall
. Also, mine were started in 8" of water and when I moved them to my new sump they are standing in at least 12" of water. JME. HTH.
<STRONG> I got 10 from florida plants online, and only 2 have leaves left.</STRONG><HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Dave, There is a very good chance your plants are fine. To rid themselves of excess salt when suddenly exposed to salt water, mangroves will intentionally drop their leaves to speed the process. I received 10 also from floridaplants and dropped them right in. Almost all lost all their leaves with a small exception, but now, a year later all 10 are growing fine. Some over 3' tall
I have ordered mangroves from several sources. The cheapest source is Ebay, about $1 a piece. However, the ones from Ebay do not have many leaves. IME the best way to acclimate them is leave them in a pot of aged fresh water in a partially shaded area until their roots are more developed. Usually this would take a couple weeks. Once they developed new roots I just plop them in my saltwater sump. Zero % mortality using this method.
HTH
HTH
I just ordered (and arrived) 20 mangroves from Florida online (actually, the order was taken by Mangrove Unlimited). I did spoke to the owner of the Mangrove Unlimited (MU). Its a father and son operation. They actually go pick up mangrove seed droplings and grow them from the seed. All were grown in freshwater. They did told me to acclimate them over 5 days with gradual increase in salinity. I have decided to acclimate them over 2 weeks, Just in case.
The plants that I got is great. Most have substantial fine roots developed and have at least 6-10 leaves. I plan on getting them acclimized and sell half to my LFS.
The plants that I got is great. Most have substantial fine roots developed and have at least 6-10 leaves. I plan on getting them acclimized and sell half to my LFS.
- Location
- Virginia
I am hoping that is the case as far as just being a leaf drop, but I know that at least 2 are completely dead as the sprout has dried up and curled, and the "trunk" has completely shriveled and hardened. 2 have leaves again, and I am hoping that the other 6 recover as well. I am familiar with the leaf drop, and I have another set of mangroves that I am growing out in freshwater for a bit before beginning to acclimate them. They all have multiple branches so I am hoping to not lose any part of them. I still believe that you should acclimate them slowly. The 2 weeks is what I will do when I am ready to transplant the freshwater ones.
Hi,
I do not have experience growing mangroves in a tank, but am familiar with their ecology in the wild and have some thoughts. How old are these mangroves and what kind of tank set up are you talking about? The species of mangrove might also be important (i.e. red mangroves are much more tolerant of soaking than black or white mangroves (if we are talking Caribbean species). Older mangroves (those having prop roots) need to have prop roots above water to allow O2 exchange. Baby mangroves that have just droped off of the parent tree usually settle succesfuly in fairly shallow water (about 2-8 inches from casual observation). I would suggest not exceeding the depth of the buld like bottom root by more that an inch or two. I hope some of this helps.
David C.
I do not have experience growing mangroves in a tank, but am familiar with their ecology in the wild and have some thoughts. How old are these mangroves and what kind of tank set up are you talking about? The species of mangrove might also be important (i.e. red mangroves are much more tolerant of soaking than black or white mangroves (if we are talking Caribbean species). Older mangroves (those having prop roots) need to have prop roots above water to allow O2 exchange. Baby mangroves that have just droped off of the parent tree usually settle succesfuly in fairly shallow water (about 2-8 inches from casual observation). I would suggest not exceeding the depth of the buld like bottom root by more that an inch or two. I hope some of this helps.
David C.
Thanks for all the replies.
David C. - these are Rhizophora Mangle from Hawaii. They are small plants with just a couple leaves. Right now I have them in about 8" of water. I believe they were grown in saltwater, but this is second hand info so I think I'll verify that with the seller.
The plants look healthy, I'm just wondering if they'll adjust to a deeper tank or if I'll need to make some cnanges.
Thanks,
Dan
David C. - these are Rhizophora Mangle from Hawaii. They are small plants with just a couple leaves. Right now I have them in about 8" of water. I believe they were grown in saltwater, but this is second hand info so I think I'll verify that with the seller.
The plants look healthy, I'm just wondering if they'll adjust to a deeper tank or if I'll need to make some cnanges.
Thanks,
Dan
Wellllll, so much for second hand info. I just double checked with Brian Hurov and he does grow his mangroves in freshwater.
Unfortunatly, I've had them in saltwater for over a week, I don't think there's much point in putting them in fresh water now. They haven't lost any leaves yet, but neither have they grown any. I guess we'll see what happens.
Dan
Unfortunatly, I've had them in saltwater for over a week, I don't think there's much point in putting them in fresh water now. They haven't lost any leaves yet, but neither have they grown any. I guess we'll see what happens.
Dan
DKKA,
I got the same thing from Brian on ebay.Mine didn't have any leaves on them when I recieved them. I acclimated them for about 4 days. I have them in about 7 inches of water in my top sump and all are starting to sprout leaves and no casualties. heres a pic: <A HREF="http://www.reeftalk.com/cgi-bin/album.pl?photo=equipment/sump_2001.jpg" TARGET=_blank>
mangroves in my sump</A>
HTH
I got the same thing from Brian on ebay.Mine didn't have any leaves on them when I recieved them. I acclimated them for about 4 days. I have them in about 7 inches of water in my top sump and all are starting to sprout leaves and no casualties. heres a pic: <A HREF="http://www.reeftalk.com/cgi-bin/album.pl?photo=equipment/sump_2001.jpg" TARGET=_blank>
mangroves in my sump</A>
HTH
DKKA,
You can plant seedlings as deep as you want as long as the leaves are exposed to air. They excreet salt from the base of the leaves. If the seedling has no leaves yet, make sure the top of the seed is out of the water. Once the roots start to grow, don't expose them to the air for long periods of time. If your sump/refugium is too deep for them, float them in styrofoam blocks untill they grow large enough. Hope this helps.
Chris
You can plant seedlings as deep as you want as long as the leaves are exposed to air. They excreet salt from the base of the leaves. If the seedling has no leaves yet, make sure the top of the seed is out of the water. Once the roots start to grow, don't expose them to the air for long periods of time. If your sump/refugium is too deep for them, float them in styrofoam blocks untill they grow large enough. Hope this helps.
Chris
I began keeping mangroves back in 1979. Not alot of information was published at the time. But, here are some (of many) key points from my experience that may help you out.
Mangrove seedlings (or are called pods/beans), which have not started to grow leaves, plant them 1 to 2 inches in the sand bed you are trying to grow them in. And leave 1/2 to 2/3 of the pod exposed to air. The water level about another 1 1/2 - 2" or so above the growing medium.
Don't jab them into sand. (They are plants). Scoop the sand out and repack around the pod.
Since they are plants, have a quality "gro-lux" bulb or similiar for them when they are sprouting leaves. I have seen people trying to grow these guys under 40 watt bulbs in their sumps. It just won't do. They will start to grow and will probably die without the proper lighting.
Once growing, mist them with freshwater. Just like a natural rain shower. They need it to remove the small salt deposits built up under the leaves/branches as they grow.
In nature, I always see healthy, mature plants grow in mucky, nutrient areas. You don't see mature plants growing in poor substrates. So, actually I put my plants in a plastic container (3/8 holes drilled to allow water to flow) within the tank. The growing medium is mixed up with fine sand, crushed coral and sterilized potting soil. And on the top, a good layer of crushed coral to keep it compacted.
I have tried to grow these guys without a substrate for their roots. They'll grow with leaves and later die. I feel the substrate is very important.
I had these plants for over six years in a 30 tall with a 20 gallon high placed inverted as a top, and grew to more than 3 feet tall (and trimmed them several times). I had fiddler crabs, mangrove crabs and other creatures growing. It's a swamp! I gave them to a botanist. Now after having two batches of Mangrove Planted Tanks Only (MPTO), I have started to contruct a mangrove refugium to be plumed to my third reef tank that has finished cycling. I will be growing them in a DSB without the inside container tank.
I collected these pods on my many trips to Florida and when I lived there.
Hope this helps. It has worked for me.
Mangrove seedlings (or are called pods/beans), which have not started to grow leaves, plant them 1 to 2 inches in the sand bed you are trying to grow them in. And leave 1/2 to 2/3 of the pod exposed to air. The water level about another 1 1/2 - 2" or so above the growing medium.
Don't jab them into sand. (They are plants). Scoop the sand out and repack around the pod.
Since they are plants, have a quality "gro-lux" bulb or similiar for them when they are sprouting leaves. I have seen people trying to grow these guys under 40 watt bulbs in their sumps. It just won't do. They will start to grow and will probably die without the proper lighting.
Once growing, mist them with freshwater. Just like a natural rain shower. They need it to remove the small salt deposits built up under the leaves/branches as they grow.
In nature, I always see healthy, mature plants grow in mucky, nutrient areas. You don't see mature plants growing in poor substrates. So, actually I put my plants in a plastic container (3/8 holes drilled to allow water to flow) within the tank. The growing medium is mixed up with fine sand, crushed coral and sterilized potting soil. And on the top, a good layer of crushed coral to keep it compacted.
I have tried to grow these guys without a substrate for their roots. They'll grow with leaves and later die. I feel the substrate is very important.
I had these plants for over six years in a 30 tall with a 20 gallon high placed inverted as a top, and grew to more than 3 feet tall (and trimmed them several times). I had fiddler crabs, mangrove crabs and other creatures growing. It's a swamp! I gave them to a botanist. Now after having two batches of Mangrove Planted Tanks Only (MPTO), I have started to contruct a mangrove refugium to be plumed to my third reef tank that has finished cycling. I will be growing them in a DSB without the inside container tank.
I collected these pods on my many trips to Florida and when I lived there.
Hope this helps. It has worked for me.
I got the same thing from Brian on ebay. It was more two month ago. Although, the plants were 10" to 15" tall, it didn't have any leaves on them when I recieved them.
I checked with Brian before I planted it. He stated the plants already acclimated to the saltwater so I just put the plants right into my sumps. So far, all plants survive.
Only 5 Out of 30 plants I received from him are still in a dormant stage, i.e. no leaves yet. However, I do notice a nice root growth for the 5 dormant plants. The rest, 25 plants, are growing really nicely with leaves. Some have gained another 4" or 6" high. One thing to watch out, don't put strong light(best no light) on the top of plants for the first few months when they are still acclimating since this will burn them.
I checked with Brian before I planted it. He stated the plants already acclimated to the saltwater so I just put the plants right into my sumps. So far, all plants survive.
Only 5 Out of 30 plants I received from him are still in a dormant stage, i.e. no leaves yet. However, I do notice a nice root growth for the 5 dormant plants. The rest, 25 plants, are growing really nicely with leaves. Some have gained another 4" or 6" high. One thing to watch out, don't put strong light(best no light) on the top of plants for the first few months when they are still acclimating since this will burn them.
Dan,
Sorry for the late reply. The species of mangrove you have (R. mangle) is the one of the most salt tolerant mangrove species. It should do fine in salt water with proper acclimation if first raised in fresh water. This particular species maintains much lower salt concentrations internally than many other mangroves, mainly through being less permeable to salt. I imagine some people raise these trees in fresh water to maximize growth. Mangroves grow just fine in fresh water. The reason we do not see them in fresh water habitats is simply because other trees/plants outcompete them. Your depth sounds a bit on the deep side, but if the leaves and some trunk are exposed to the air, you should be fine. The advice given in the previous post by C- water seems sound. Also, the post mentioning misting the plants also sounds good. In nature, these tress benefit from periodic fresh water influx that prevents hypersaline conditions. In your tank, where salt concentrations do not build up, the mangroves might not need this. I will leave that question open for those experienced in raising the mangroves.
David C.
Sorry for the late reply. The species of mangrove you have (R. mangle) is the one of the most salt tolerant mangrove species. It should do fine in salt water with proper acclimation if first raised in fresh water. This particular species maintains much lower salt concentrations internally than many other mangroves, mainly through being less permeable to salt. I imagine some people raise these trees in fresh water to maximize growth. Mangroves grow just fine in fresh water. The reason we do not see them in fresh water habitats is simply because other trees/plants outcompete them. Your depth sounds a bit on the deep side, but if the leaves and some trunk are exposed to the air, you should be fine. The advice given in the previous post by C- water seems sound. Also, the post mentioning misting the plants also sounds good. In nature, these tress benefit from periodic fresh water influx that prevents hypersaline conditions. In your tank, where salt concentrations do not build up, the mangroves might not need this. I will leave that question open for those experienced in raising the mangroves.
David C.
I double checked my email from Brian Hurov and he does say they were grown in freshwater. Seems strange that he's told others they were grown in salt. (unless he does both) Regardless, mine have adapted fine to saltwater, and haven't lost any leaves.
C-Water, sounds like a nice swamp you had going, I would have had trouble parting with it.
Thanks again for all the replies.
Dan
C-Water, sounds like a nice swamp you had going, I would have had trouble parting with it.
Thanks again for all the replies.
Dan
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